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 Posted: Thu Jul 23, 2020 1:01 pm |
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Joined: Jul 11, 2011
Posts: 95
Trade Rating: 0
Location: Kent
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Afternoon,
From having the car running the best it has been in years, the wife's 2000, 206, 1.4i, petrol lost power last night and she limped home. Sounds as rough as and there's a fuel smell too. Said there was a noise when it lost power. Not a bang mind. I was favouring the coil pack but wondering if this split pipe could be the issue. The BiL did it by accident and I repaired with self amalgamating tape. Been fine until now. I'd replace it but don't know the part number if anyone can help.
If one plug was duff would that do it?
I could only change 3 when I did them last (this year). Couldn't even get the plug spanner on / to engage one plug, like there was crap down there. Tried a little inspection camera but quality wasn't good enough. Should have looked/done it when the head was off.
F*** knows how to get it out without taking the head off. Even the BiL tried to no avail. From memory it looked like there was hard, burnt black stuff down there but as I say the inspection camera was crap. Rubber on the coil pack is intact so no ideas what's down there. Would a drop of atf poured down there help soften things up and get down into the plug threads?
Cheers
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| ..........I can\'t help it I just like French cars! | |
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Posted: Thu Jul 23, 2020 4:04 pm |
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Joined: Jan 06, 2020
Posts: 176
Trade Rating: 0
Location: Cheshire
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That's not the only thing that's lost power, the whole forum has been gone a couple of days too! Not sure what happened, but I was just getting a message that the domain was suspended :/ Had me worried for a minute!
So I'm assuming you have a bad misfire, running on two cylinders? EML on?
Ideally a code read would help but as a first port of call I think you could be on the money with coil pack, especially if one plug is old/damaged/fouled. When the plugs wear out, they need more current to fire & this puts strain on the coil pack. Definitely try to dig out whatever crap is in the plug channel, possibly burned up rubber from a previous coil pack melted onto it, or perhaps more likely the insert out of someone's spark plug socket?
I'd suggest either soaking with ATF as you say, or brake cleaner/rubbing alcohol & trying to break up the crap with a small screwdriver/pick etc so you can blow it out of there, maybe try and grab it with long nose pliers and pull it out but either way definitely get that cleaned out and replace the plugs before fitting a new coil pack so they don't strain the replacement too.
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| '02 1.4HDi Mercury Grey 102k (waiting for it's time to shine once more)
'03 GTi 180 Aegean Blue 92k (suffering gearbox/diff issues)
'53 Obsidian Black XUD9TE/veg fuelled b-road toy (in surgery for MoT workarounds)
'56 SW 1.4i Verve Aegean Blue 70k (new £50 project with roasted lump)
+'95 Citroen Xantia 1.9D auto (on loan to inlaws)
+'99 306 2.0SE cabriolet
+'97 306 1.9LXDT
French Car Forums | |
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Posted: Thu Jul 23, 2020 5:32 pm |
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Joined: Jul 11, 2011
Posts: 95
Trade Rating: 0
Location: Kent
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I had a panic when I saw the forum down I must admit, thought I'd been banned!
Attempted to get the spark plug (that I couldn't before) out again. Less a question of putting atf down there, I can't even get the plug socket on! It goes so far but just won't engage and just spins. The plug socket sits up higher than when I put it on the other 3 plugs. Managed to get a dodgy old endoscope working and aside from the carp picture I can't see why it won't engage onto the hex of the spark plug. No apparent burnt crud down there I can see. I might add I fitted the spark plug I can't get out originally... initially by hand of course to get it started and avoid cross threading.
Whilst under there I repaired the crank breather pipe with a bit of split 20mm flexible electrical conduit then silicone amalgamating tape. Seems sound.
So I fitted the new coil pack...
It starts and runs pretty much as it should. Drives fast / smooth enough up the road. Doesn't feel if it's only running on 2 or 3 cylinders. HOWEVER there's a funny, underlying "knocking" noise most noticeable when idling. Not sure if it's in fact a knocking or a firing (misfiring?) noise. Can't tell if it's coming from under the rocker cover, coil pack or that black box to the right of the expansion bottle. I'll take the coil pack off and refit in case that's gone on wrong. Will also try and get the thinnest wall plug socket I can.
Link to video clip of the "knocking" noise:
flic.kr/p/2jp8z1W
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| ..........I can\'t help it I just like French cars! | |
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Posted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 7:41 am |
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Joined: Feb 08, 2010
Posts: 2369
Trade Rating: +15
Location: Gloucestershire, UK
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Sorry! We don't know why the forum went down the other day.... I thought it was because we'd been having problems between the host and Paypal in the past, but turns out not. But we've not been given a specific reason as to why.
That knock sounds very much like one I had a little while ago on the GTi I'd recently bought, and in my case it was the spark plugs.
When I checked them I discovered one was completely loose, and another was very much worse for wear and the others weren't much better and after I changed them all, the knocking went away! So I'm not entirely sure which caused it.
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Posted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 9:35 am |
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Joined: Jan 06, 2020
Posts: 176
Trade Rating: 0
Location: Cheshire
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Agree that sounds more like a "compression escaping" kind of sound than an actual knock although I stand to be corrected, and looking at the stuck plug it shows no real sign of leakage past it. Nothing jumps out as why it'd not allow a socket on either, can see a little black crud around the bottom of the photo but nothing I'd expect to cause a problem.
Hope it's just being French and a thin walled socket gets it to play ball. Also, if forums were cars I'd put the outage down to French electrics lol.
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| '02 1.4HDi Mercury Grey 102k (waiting for it's time to shine once more)
'03 GTi 180 Aegean Blue 92k (suffering gearbox/diff issues)
'53 Obsidian Black XUD9TE/veg fuelled b-road toy (in surgery for MoT workarounds)
'56 SW 1.4i Verve Aegean Blue 70k (new £50 project with roasted lump)
+'95 Citroen Xantia 1.9D auto (on loan to inlaws)
+'99 306 2.0SE cabriolet
+'97 306 1.9LXDT
French Car Forums | |
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Posted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 4:14 pm |
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Joined: Jul 11, 2011
Posts: 95
Trade Rating: 0
Location: Kent
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Evening. The problem was a loose plug, the one I couldn't get the plug spanner on! The slightly thinner walled socket went on (plug nearest the o/s). The weird thing is that that was one of the 3 new plugs I'd previously managed to change with a THICKER walled plug spanner!
Checking the others and the one next to it was fine as in tight but THIS appears to be the one I couldn't get out when I changed them as it was an "old" plug.
All running good now but it beats me as to the why.
Never even knew plugs could work loose.
Begs the question whether the original coil pack is in fact OK.
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| ..........I can\'t help it I just like French cars! | |
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Posted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 9:47 pm |
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Joined: Jan 06, 2020
Posts: 176
Trade Rating: 0
Location: Cheshire
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Not sure of the mechanism but two plugs on our 180 were slightly loose when I changed them also. Not noticed it on any other make/model & before this thread I'd just put it down to lax work by the last owner but now I'm wondering if it's a Pug "thing" for some reason.
I'd be willing to bet if the coil pack had previously broken down then it's likely dead even with new plugs. When the one died on the 180 I changed the plugs while waiting for the new coil pack to arrive and the only improvement it made was we could get all the way through town before it dropped onto 2 cylinders rather than it missing from the moment it started.
Glad it's going OK again now, it's always scary when they start making noises like that!
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| '02 1.4HDi Mercury Grey 102k (waiting for it's time to shine once more)
'03 GTi 180 Aegean Blue 92k (suffering gearbox/diff issues)
'53 Obsidian Black XUD9TE/veg fuelled b-road toy (in surgery for MoT workarounds)
'56 SW 1.4i Verve Aegean Blue 70k (new £50 project with roasted lump)
+'95 Citroen Xantia 1.9D auto (on loan to inlaws)
+'99 306 2.0SE cabriolet
+'97 306 1.9LXDT
French Car Forums | |
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Posted: Thu Jan 06, 2022 6:55 pm |
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Joined: Jul 11, 2011
Posts: 95
Trade Rating: 0
Location: Kent
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18 months down the line and the 1.4i 206 is running dog rough. Lumpy as hell. Crap acceleration, noisy etc. You really have to gun it. Can't get one plug out, tried 3 different plug spanners. Just won't sit down over the hex. The 3 plugs I pulled out look ok.
Looking at the receipt for the coil pack in Jul 20, does anyone know the make?
I'm wondering...if my original issue back then was just a loose plug whether it's worth putting the old coil pack back on and trying that?
Plugs btw are NGK.
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| ..........I can\'t help it I just like French cars! | |
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Posted: Tue Jan 11, 2022 10:24 am |
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Joined: Nov 27, 2010
Posts: 11520
Trade Rating: +10
Location: What's it to you? ? ?
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| clicon357 wrote: |
Plugs btw are NGK. |
Try a set of Bosch spark plugs first.
NGK spark plugs are best avoided in the TU engines used around this era of PSA products as they can upset the misfire phase detection system used by the engine ecu.
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| Toyota C-HR GR Sport 2.0 Hybrid with JBL & Alcantara packs. | |
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Posted: Tue Jan 11, 2022 11:48 am |
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Joined: Jul 11, 2011
Posts: 95
Trade Rating: 0
Location: Kent
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New Bosch coil pack and nickel plugs (0 242 235 666) fitted. I need to take the plugs back out and gap at 0.9mm - thought they came pre gapped! The car runs better but it's still low on power imo. I'm thinking injector(s). Done 135K now and I think original. Been quoted circa £55 for a Bosch injector. Assume that's plus vat but I might get some discount. Doing four will be more than the car's worth!
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| ..........I can\'t help it I just like French cars! | |
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Posted: Tue Jan 11, 2022 6:32 pm |
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Joined: Jul 11, 2011
Posts: 95
Trade Rating: 0
Location: Kent
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One plug gap was a little tight. Fixed that, all at 0.9mm now. I'd say it runs better again but still not right. I took the heat shield off and used an IR thermometer on the exhaust manifold. Very rough but the port nearest the o/s is about 100degF lower. Pictures left to right, o/s to n/s:
Injector?
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| ..........I can\'t help it I just like French cars! | |
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Posted: Thu Jan 13, 2022 6:17 am |
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Joined: Jul 11, 2011
Posts: 95
Trade Rating: 0
Location: Kent
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I think I need to look at the tappets too but have never done it. Google / YouTube here I come!
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| ..........I can\'t help it I just like French cars! | |
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Posted: Sat Feb 05, 2022 5:30 pm |
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Joined: Jul 11, 2011
Posts: 95
Trade Rating: 0
Location: Kent
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Solved. It was a duff injector on No.4.
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| ..........I can\'t help it I just like French cars! | |
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