#16: Re: pulling left when in neutral Author: V9977, Location: Athens, GreecePosted: Thu May 09, 2013 9:23 am ---- Measure in mm and clean it so you get as precise measurement as possible.
Also, with engine off; if you gently wobble the steering-wheel can you feel a 'tooth being loose' and significant free-play?
Try it first centered, then start-engine, get it 90 deg. to the left, switch-off check again and the same to the right, check again.
The trouble is so many factors contribute to getting alignment correct and the car handling nicely and safely as it was designed-to.
As Kandlebarret said, the rear is also critical in the resultant adjustment needed. That's why it's important to get a printout as to what is happening roughly with the rear as well as the front wheels.
#17: Re: pulling left when in neutral Author: Sim, Location: West CountryPosted: Thu May 09, 2013 9:26 am ---- V9977 many thanks on the notes you and others gave. I will run the tests you've asked.
Could you please comment if I should have wishbones sorted first and foremost?
#18: Re: pulling left when in neutral Author: Sim, Location: West CountryPosted: Thu May 09, 2013 9:35 am ---- The steering wheel had significant play until yesterday. After yesterday's wheel balancing and swap, now that the worn tires and on the rear axle, the play is minimal, barely felt even.
I will do the 0-90 deg turn play test in the evening, when get 'round to the car (now I drove only upto the car-sharer's place, he drives on afterwards, -- don't want to risk running my precious Pug too far)
#19: Re: pulling left when in neutral Author: V9977, Location: Athens, GreecePosted: Thu May 09, 2013 10:01 am ----
sledge wrote:
V9977 many thanks on the notes you and others gave. I will run the tests you've asked.
Could you please comment if I should have wishbones sorted first and foremost?
Wishbones always help loads with this issue wether it's geometry, or bushes, or ball joints affecting it.
But I still think it's better to investigate all the things you can first, and bear in-mind many times it's simply not aligned correctly - even if done recently.
#20: Re: pulling left when in neutral Author: Sim, Location: West CountryPosted: Thu May 09, 2013 10:07 am ---- Ok. Just to refresh the timeline:
Since that moment, the stability/maneuverability/reliability of the car has been decreasing until the point beyond comfort, that I started posting here
#21: Re: pulling left when in neutral Author: MrBSI, Location: What's it to you? ? ?Posted: Thu May 09, 2013 10:25 am ---- Get Bodie & Doyle to have a look at it.
#22: Re: pulling left when in neutral Author: Sim, Location: West CountryPosted: Thu May 09, 2013 10:26 am ---- Was about to go to TyresDirect ... &)
For Bodie & Doyle google gives out "The Professionals (TV series)", nothing servicing related.. Are you taking a mick sir?
#23: Re: pulling left when in neutral Author: Sim, Location: West CountryPosted: Thu May 09, 2013 10:40 am ---- Robins & Day? I guess that'd be worth investing this time, but I'll give TyresDirect a good whiplashing first, if they misaligned anything back in February
#24: Re: pulling left when in neutral Author: Sim, Location: West CountryPosted: Fri May 10, 2013 4:12 am ---- News from alignment: wishbones haven't been 1:1 matched during replacement of one of them 3months ago. Back to get my warranty in the garage
I did see those wishbones for myself this morning: one has an odd bend shaped from a factory
#25: Re: pulling left when in neutral Author: Sim, Location: West CountryPosted: Sat May 11, 2013 7:12 am ---- Replaced both lower arms this morning, still the same. Pulls way to the left when accelerating, and pulls way to the right when decelerating..
Tracking was off, aligned now, same problem. Robins & Day booked this booked Monday
#26: Re: pulling left when in neutral Author: V9977, Location: Athens, GreecePosted: Sat May 11, 2013 7:29 am ---- 1) What is the thread showing on each of the track-rod ends in mm?
2) Have you checked for free-play in the manner described above?
3) Did you get a before/after print-out for all wheels?
#27: Re: pulling left when in neutral Author: Sim, Location: West CountryPosted: Sat May 11, 2013 8:47 am ---- 1) Will do in an hour
2) No play, no 'loose tooth'
3) That place doesn't do printout, just front wheel align. Will stab at problem at peugeot dealer, cant find more money to go to ProTires
#28: Re: pulling left when in neutral Author: V9977, Location: Athens, GreecePosted: Sat May 11, 2013 9:02 am ---- I wouldn't think Peugeot dealer would be cheaper than anywhere else.
I really think it wasn't aligned properly to begin-with. Was it the same people/rig that alligned it again as last time?
Idealy you'd go to a place with 4 heads (usually gyroscopic) and get a before / after printout.
Measuring an angle of -0.7 deg. on a wheel is not simple really.
Many places don't say anything but instead give it a turn or two, for fear of the setup changing substancialy and you not being used to it leading to an accident or complaints. A bad one really because this issue is even more 'sneaky' than brakes when it comes to safety.
The car would have left the factory with 13mm of thread showing, plus/minus quarter-turn absolute max.
Since you are getting so much torque-steer, my guess would be excessive & assymetric toe.
'Hope you sort it, and well done for trying to set things right.
#29: Re: pulling left when in neutral Author: Sim, Location: West CountryPosted: Sat May 11, 2013 2:11 pm ---- Driver Side: 13mm
Passenger side: ~8mm
&)
#30: Re: pulling left when in neutral Author: Sim, Location: West CountryPosted: Sat May 11, 2013 2:29 pm ----
V9977 wrote:
I wouldn't think Peugeot dealer would be cheaper than anywhere else.
Taking bets anyone? Every car mechanic/pro/enthusiast I asked gave me a different suspect:
wheel tracking - inspected/aligned twice already, in the same garage/people/rig
tie rod ends - naked eye/hand dab checks only so far
steering wheel column components - same as above
driveshafts/gearbox - really?
one of the engine mounts going
rear axle alignment
Ruled out:
only one worn wishbone replaced in February 2013 - replaced both this morning - didn't help the slightest
wheel balancing/tire wear - wheels balanced, swapped last Wednesday
Quote::
I really think it wasn't aligned properly to begin-with. Was it the same people/rig that alligned it again as last time?
Yes, as per above.
Quote::
Idealy you'd go to a place with 4 heads (usually gyroscopic) and get a before / after printout.
I trust you V9977, but I also trusted others, and threw in some crazy money already
So can't be dabbing at this any longer (see the list of suspects), and will just give it to peugeot dealer to find a problem on monday (road test is free, £53 for looking deeper in if not obvious after road test)
Quote::
The car would have left the factory with 13mm of thread showing, plus/minus quarter-turn absolute max.
Since you are getting so much torque-steer, my guess would be excessive & assymetric toe.
Looks like you are the closest to win the bet here! O/S 13mm vs 8mm N/S
But, primitively speaking, if I bring it to the 4wheel alignment place, and they bring passenger side back to 13mm, and the wheels will be off - I believe the rootcause is somewhere else (car had frontal bodywork accident October 2012, hitting another car in front at ~15MPH).
Quote::
'Hope you sort it, and well done for trying to set things right.
Cheers to you mate, and all other forum members, friends and fellow mechanics, thanks for being there for me and the car! Hope we'll crack this nut
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Every car mechanic/pro/enthusiast I asked gave me a different suspect:
