#31: Re: pulling left when in neutral Author: V9977, Location: Athens, GreecePosted: Sat May 11, 2013 6:45 pm ---- No it's not a matter of bringing it to 13mm both sides and expecting it to be correct. It won't be.
The point is it should be roughly at 13mm with a small deviation (+/- quarter, or half of a turn) otherwise something else is going-on and the person doing it should know this.
On most 206's of age that I've seen it's usually for example 13.5 /14.5, or 14 /13, or 14 /14 etc.
13 /8 is a massive difference and will likely be causing the problems you're experiencing. You might even be able to see the near-side wheel pointing out (with the steering wheel centered on level ground), just by looking at it.
NOTE: This threads 'check' is NOT in any way to be quoted or applied as a measurement even though Haynes refers to it as Peugeot recomendation for initial setting. The car must be aligned on a proper rig by qualified technician according to the required toe angle etc. obviously.
15mph crash, engine mount, gearbox, steering coloumn, highly doubt it.
Surely brakes would have been checked for binding by now.
Personaly I would first take it somewhere else for alignment before changing any more parts. If that's Peugeot, even better.
#32: Re: pulling left when in neutral Author: Sim, Location: West CountryPosted: Sun May 12, 2013 6:06 am ---- Thanks again for enlightenment.
I'd surely like to save money, but in your opinion, what is the probability of ProTires (4 wheel computerised alignment) finding (or not finding at all) a rootcause such that they themselves cannot fix (e.g. brakes touching or graver)? If that probability is high enough, then I'd rather just drop it off straight at Peugeot's and hope for the best.
Things are becoming really interesting indeed
#33: Re: pulling left when in neutral Author: kandlbarrett, Location: SwindonPosted: Sun May 12, 2013 11:28 am ---- So no play in track rod ends. New wishbones fitted both sides.
I assume that the car is not lowered - is it?
You have not investigated the rear end yet - get a good mechanic to check it out for play - and you have not had 4 wheel alignment done with printout. I suggested both ages ago or have I missed your posting on these suggestions.
#34: Re: pulling left when in neutral Author: Sim, Location: West CountryPosted: Sun May 12, 2013 4:31 pm ---- Ok mates, going here tomorrow: www.fcmwheelalignment.co.uk
#35: Re: pulling left when in neutral Author: V9977, Location: Athens, GreecePosted: Sun May 12, 2013 8:43 pm ----
kandlbarrett wrote:
So no play in track rod ends. New wishbones fitted both sides.
I assume that the car is not lowered - is it?
You have not investigated the rear end yet - get a good mechanic to check it out for play - and you have not had 4 wheel alignment done with printout. I suggested both ages ago or have I missed your posting on these suggestions.
Strongly agree.
The point of checking the rear is that if for any reason it's outside of tolerance limmits, it will be flaged-red on the figures and % will be given which tells the technician that eg. no-matter how spot-on the front is adjusted, the rear is affecting beyond hope.
It is not possible to 'compensate' for rear problems at the front. The front toe setting is standard and that's that.
There is no other adjustment on the 206 (camber/caster, rear etc).
But IF there is an issue at the rear, often it can be spotted/discovered by experienced mechanic before he even puts it on the alignment rig.
By the various descriptions given so far I recon it is not a subtle thing going-on. It's worth discussing and giving as much info as possible to the next garage about the symptom, but without encouraging them to replace major things unless they discover something certain by themselves.
I still think 99% of the time it's simply not tracked right.
#36: Re: pulling left when in neutral Author: Lecktorious, Location: ScotlandPosted: Mon May 13, 2013 1:21 am ----
V9977 wrote:
Strongly agree.
The point of checking the rear is that if for any reason it's outside of tolerance limmits, it will be flaged-red on the figures and % will be given which tells the technician that eg. no-matter how spot-on the front is adjusted, the rear is affecting beyond hope.
It is not possible to 'compensate' for rear problems at the front. The front toe setting is standard and that's that.
There is no other adjustment on the 206 (camber/caster, rear etc).
But IF there is an issue at the rear, often it can be spotted/discovered by experienced mechanic before he even puts it on the alignment rig.
.
It's not always possible to tell if something is wrong with the naked eye, the tolerances are quite fine. I had a bent trailing arm that didn't show up until I had a 4 wheel alignment done and checked the print out.
OP, wouldn't bother wasting any more time or money on trouble shooting. Get the tracking checked and let a mechanic figure it out.
#37: Re: pulling left when in neutral Author: V9977, Location: Athens, GreecePosted: Mon May 13, 2013 3:48 am ----
Lecktorious wrote:
It's not always possible to tell if something is wrong with the naked eye, the tolerances are quite fine. I had a bent trailing arm that didn't show up until I had a 4 wheel alignment done and checked the print out.
OP, wouldn't bother wasting any more time or money on trouble shooting. Get the tracking checked and let a mechanic figure it out.
I think this is exactly what he's been trying to do. I don't believe he wants to do it on his own and it's always better to find what's going-on first, then start replacing things throwing money at it.
Lecktorious wrote:
It's not always possible to tell if something is wrong with the naked eye, the tolerances are quite fine. I had a bent trailing arm that didn't show up until I had a 4 wheel alignment done and checked the print out.OP, wouldn't bother wasting any more time or money on trouble shooting. Get the tracking checked and let a mechanic figure it out.
You ain't kidding. They are fine indeed when it comes to this.
However if you read the post again you'll see why I say this.
#38: Re: pulling left when in neutral Author: Sim, Location: West CountryPosted: Mon May 13, 2013 4:19 am ---- Just dropped off at 4 wheel alignment with printouts. Results in the evening.
Car is not lowered. But has bigger wheels attached from originally a 307 ( over a year ago)
I listened to the front-wheel alignment shop (because I thought they are reputable in advising people with such problems like mine) and changed wishbones.
I know I should've listened to you, just my mind got too many advises from other mechanics I know f2f. Sorry but we are where we are Hope for the best! That its only alognment problem. If not, I understand ths printouts will be indispensable even for Peugeot dealer while they'll be looking into the problem.. Because My local garages and car friends have no clue anymore after numerous visual and hand checks
#39: Re: pulling left when in neutral Author: V9977, Location: Athens, GreecePosted: Mon May 13, 2013 4:31 am ----
sledge wrote:
Just dropped off at 4 wheel alignment with printouts. Results in the evening.
Car is not lowered. But has bigger wheels attached from originally a 307 ( over a year ago)
I listened to the front-wheel alignment shop (because I thought they are reputable in advising people with such problems like mine) and changed wishbones.
I know I should've listened to you, just my mind got too many advises from other mechanics I know f2f. Sorry but we are where we are Hope for the best! That its only alognment problem. If not, I understand ths printouts will be indispensable even for Peugeot dealer while they'll be looking into the problem.. Because My local garages and car friends have no clue anymore after numerous visual and hand checks
I think so and they usually include before & after adjustment values on them.
#40: Re: pulling left when in neutral Author: Sim, Location: West CountryPosted: Mon May 13, 2013 4:38 am ---- Yes, the good guy Lee said there will be before- and after-printouts Last edited by Sim on Tue May 14, 2013 7:47 am; edited 1 time in total
#41: Re: pulling left when in neutral Author: Sim, Location: West CountryPosted: Mon May 13, 2013 9:41 am ---- Not so good news over the phone: the tracking was out 5mm. He test-driven it after adjusting the tracking, problem still there (he doesn't know if symptoms eased off, because he did not test-drive it beforehand)
I will get printouts in the evening, and he will lift the car up on the ramp later in the afternoon to try to find a mechanical problem, but if he finds something, said it's not in his competence to fix those...
So I'm looking into going on garaging car elsewhere as a next step. Risking another (proper, non local) garage around Bristol to save some £££, or just drop it off at Robins&Day ?..
#42: Re: pulling left when in neutral Author: V9977, Location: Athens, GreecePosted: Mon May 13, 2013 10:41 am ---- 5mm is masses, see how it goes when you drive it and it'll also be interesting to see the figures ofcourse.
I would take it one step at a time and take time after each step.
Not an over-the-phone job this..
#43: Re: pulling left when in neutral Author: Sim, Location: West CountryPosted: Mon May 13, 2013 10:49 am ---- Ok, V9977, one gear at a time
PS: he said the [now rear] tires were really worn out already (one more than another), but that still would not cause such symptoms when accelerating
#44: Re: pulling left when in neutral Author: Sim, Location: West CountryPosted: Mon May 13, 2013 1:27 pm ----
They inspected the car, nothing visually loose. Ruled out anything in the rear - if the problem is found, it will be in the front, they said.
Another mechanic said it might be differential inside gearbox starting to wear down. It's only a beginning, as there is no play in either of drive shafts.
So I got advised to research diff wear problems and symptoms.
I was also discouraged from bringing it to the dealer, as they will simply start replacing part by part as per trial-and-error
#45: Re: pulling left when in neutral Author: Sim, Location: West CountryPosted: Mon May 13, 2013 1:34 pm ---- Personally for me, the handling of the car still feels samey - wandering around the road, esp on high speeds, when accelerating and decelerating
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