#1: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: johnpidge, Posted: Fri Feb 20, 2015 10:45 am ---- My GTI 138 has done 77k and when I start from cold it starts fine first time everytime BUT a minute after starting it idles very lumpily - the car vibrates a fair bit (as if it is running on 3 cylinders) touch the trottle and it runs fine and within another minute or two idleing at tickover it slowly goes. Car goes perfectly runs very sweetly - returning 25mpg in London!!!! does not miss a beat - I have run a bit of fuel cleaner in it and I run it on Optimax (but who knows what its been run on before me!?) but havent made any difference
Plugs were changed less than a 1000 miles ago before I got it - had an oil change - new filter etc etc
Lamba sensor (I think it has two??) injectors?? or engine mounts er Im a bit baffled
Any ideas guys
#2: Re: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: Carlos_WR1, Posted: Fri Feb 20, 2015 10:47 am ---- Have you got any codes? if so get them read, if it does fire on 3 i would have thought a fault would be stored so could be down to an injector.
Other than an injector, id be looking at the knock sensor - could be an intermittent issue on it?
#3: Re: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: johnpidge, Posted: Fri Feb 20, 2015 10:49 am ---- Carlos
No I havent got any codes - I will get a reader on it - knock sensor - hmm didnt think about that!!
Thanks
#4: Re: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: kandlbarrett, Location: SwindonPosted: Fri Feb 20, 2015 11:27 am ---- You may have a list of codes that have been there a while. The first thing to do is note the codes and then clear them: do not act on them. Then start the car from cold and take the car for a drive. re-read the codes.
It wouldn't be first time someone had chased defects due to codes that were no longer relevant!
#5: Re: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: LeeThr, Location: North West WalesPosted: Fri Feb 20, 2015 11:29 am ---- Hydraulic lifters starting to fail. Common problem.
#6: Re: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: johnpidge, Posted: Fri Feb 20, 2015 11:31 am ---- Hydraulic lifters starting to fail - arghhhhhhhhhhhhh - I hope not
Will investigate
#7: Re: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: kandlbarrett, Location: SwindonPosted: Fri Feb 20, 2015 11:37 am ---- LeeThr: is there a way for John to detect which is failing to avoid buying a complete set? Obviously there are things like manifold temperature but any other good ways to check this?
Will oil flushing help?
#8: Re: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: Carlos_WR1, Posted: Fri Feb 20, 2015 12:49 pm ---- Just a thought, you mentioned the plugs had been changed some GTI's dont like running on NGK plugs and so a lot of people say to run on Bosch.
#9: Re: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: johnpidge, Posted: Fri Feb 20, 2015 1:04 pm ---- Hydralic tappets - its odd its onlyvon a cold startup and no noise - going to check plugs as well and get a readrr to check fault codes - if its the tappets are they just blocked or dirty or do they need replacing or will a good hard drive imprive them
#10: Re: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: johnpidge, Posted: Fri Feb 20, 2015 2:11 pm ---- sorry for the poor spelling and grammer - im not drunk (i wish) samsung auto spell gone a bit odd
#11: Re: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: LeeThr, Location: North West WalesPosted: Fri Feb 20, 2015 2:42 pm ---- Depending upon how bad they are, you may be able to pin point the direction by the noise. I know I have 1 if not 2 failing on cylinder 4 on the exhaust cam. can here a distinctive tapping from the rocker cover.
First thing to try though would be an oil change. See if that cures it.
On a side note though, at that millage the cambelt should have been done or at the very least somewhere in the pipeline very soon. and if it hasn't been done, it could work out in your favour as the belt would need to come off to replace the tappets anyway so both jobs could be tackled in one go reducing labour costs (if your using a garage) or saves your sanity if doing it yourself. Euro car parts do sell the tappets for £9.48 at the moment, although I can't say I know how good the quality is (or is not as may be the case) or genuine peugeot one's are £24.25 each inc vat.
#12: Re: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: johnpidge, Posted: Fri Feb 20, 2015 2:59 pm ---- Lee - it had a cambelt shortly before i bought it arghh maybe 1500 miles ago john
#13: Re: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: LeeThr, Location: North West WalesPosted: Fri Feb 20, 2015 3:56 pm ---- Try an oil change first then see if that improves it. But if it does come down to tappets the belt will have to be removed.
#14: Re: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: kandlbarrett, Location: SwindonPosted: Fri Feb 20, 2015 5:25 pm ---- Temp sensor playing up? MAPT or coolant temp sensor?
Live read of data using PP may be needed.
#15: Re: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: andy83, Location: stoke on trentPosted: Sat Feb 21, 2015 12:37 am ---- i think all has been covered here but plugs/coils/sensors are worth a look also maybe a good service/give the throttle bodie a clean whilst your at it (very easy job).
but as above defo worth getting a code reader plugged in see if that shows anything up.
#16: Re: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: johnpidge, Posted: Sat Feb 21, 2015 5:06 am ---- in for a new exhaust today inc cat - so will do another oil change later - it had done very very little miles in 3 or 4 months before i bought it - give it a hard drive and see how it goes from there (so down the M3 but never at more than 70 MPH officer!!!!). Need to get it into someone with a code reader who understands what it may throw up - need to check plugs - knock sensor - coil packs - temp etc sensors etc but it would surely show it on the reader??
Thank you everyone - was getting a bit worried about this as I had spent a bit on this and new exhaust today (Euro car parts £120!! inc cat but not back box) this car is getting a bit of a money pit BUT it is a good drive if that makes any sense. And surprisingly quick even after a Clio RS200!!!!!!!!!!!!! has a bit more low down grunt which is handy in Sarf London
#17: Re: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: johnpidge, Posted: Sun Feb 22, 2015 3:10 pm ---- Ok - oil change and filter - new exhaust inc cat - and a bottle of Wannsee hydraulic tappet stuff (well why not - what have I got to loose)
And it's 75% gone - a tiny bit of vibration a few seconds after start up and then 60 seconds later it's as if its cleared its throat and runs perfectly smoothly - maybe it's the exhaust helping - need to blag a code reader but it's better let's see how it goes for the next few days
#18: Re: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: johnpidge, Posted: Sun Feb 22, 2015 3:11 pm ---- Wynns hydraulic tappet cleaner
#19: Re: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: daninmanchester, Posted: Mon Feb 23, 2015 4:46 pm ---- temp or 02 sensor maybe?
mine is rough to start with and idles a little fast but once warmed up its fine.
Mechanic suggested it was the sensor too.
Had a full service , plugs , oil , etc and that didn't fix it so guessing it must be the sensor, but haven't bothered fixing it as it is fairly minor issue and i'm not spending any more on it just running it in to the ground
#20: Re: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: kandlbarrett, Location: SwindonPosted: Tue Feb 24, 2015 6:18 am ---- Buy a reader. £10 on ebay and you have it forever.
#21: Re: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: 206gt160, Location: BlackburnPosted: Tue Feb 24, 2015 6:21 am ---- Could also be the ICV sticking if it's the 138 Gti. Might be worth giving it a good clean with WD40, it's a quick and easy job to do.
May not be this but cleaning the idle control valve won't do any harm. My Gti-6 ICV has started sticking slightly so it runs slightly higher rpm's and abit lumpy, I have removed and cleaned it with wd40 twice and the problem goes instantly, just comes back after a few weeks!
Seems as though it could be the tappets or an exhaust leak maybe seen as it is 75 percent gone after using the winns oil and new exhaust
#22: Re: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: Edward, Location: In the garagePosted: Tue Feb 24, 2015 7:31 am ---- Does it run smoothly with throttle applied? If it's still rough it wont be the ICV.
#23: Re: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: 206gt160, Location: BlackburnPosted: Tue Feb 24, 2015 7:44 am ---- He said earlier in the post when the throttle is applied the car runs smoothly, that's what made me suggest the ICV
#24: Re: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: johnpidge, Posted: Tue Feb 24, 2015 9:14 am ---- Have ordered a reader (cheapy one off Amazon or was it fleabay) lets see what codes it comes up with
It only does it at start up and if you apply a little throttle it runs smoothly - idle control valve would make some sense -
#25: Re: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: 206gt160, Location: BlackburnPosted: Tue Feb 24, 2015 2:26 pm ---- I don't think the car will throw out a code for the ICV if it is sticking. But get the codes deleted and see how it runs. It will more than likely run the same after deleting the codes but at least the ones that return will have something to do with the problems you are having
#26: Re: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: kandlbarrett, Location: SwindonPosted: Tue Feb 24, 2015 5:23 pm ---- Note what 206gt160 has said. Clear the codes. Then run the car and re-read. Some of the existing codes, if there are any, may be quite old and nothing to do with the existing problem.
If you are going to clean the ICV (definitely worth a try) use carb cleaner and not WD40. Carb cleaner is specifically manufactured for this type of job, more effective and completely evaporates. WD40 leaves a slightly sticky residue so will gum up again over time.
Note: some (most?) carb cleaners are quite aggressive and will damage paint. Don't get it on your car.
#27: Re: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: johnpidge, Posted: Wed Feb 25, 2015 4:09 am ---- P0341 Camshaft position sensor but that seems to have cleared after I errased it - thats all
I'll give it a drive round and see if that reapears but I'm going to clean the ICV or get a new one if its not too expensive - slightly lumpy start up continues and tickover isnt 100% perfect when warm but am I expecting it to run like a jap car - its a peugeot after all??
#28: Re: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: johnpidge, Posted: Fri Feb 27, 2015 3:45 am ---- Yes P0341 Camshaft position sensor has come back up so I have ordered a new sensor from Eurocar parts (who now have all my money) and I ordered a ICV from Micks Garage a few days ago
Odd I thought the car would run very rough or the engine light (light of death!) would come up - when they have gone on cars I have had before (Subaru WRX twice!!) they went into limp home mode
Just got to find where both sensors are on the car - anyone have a good diagram to show me where to find them???????????????????
#29: Re: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: Carlos_WR1, Posted: Fri Feb 27, 2015 3:56 am ---- ICV is found on the side of the throttle body.
The camshaft position sensor i beleive is just below the engine coolant temp sensor i beleive although i could be wrong on that one.
#30: Re: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: johnpidge, Posted: Tue Mar 03, 2015 4:19 pm ---- Both done - found the camshaft sensor wasn't even fitted so I guess it was faulty anyway- still a tiny bit lumpy on cold start up
#31: Re: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: johnpidge, Posted: Tue Mar 03, 2015 4:20 pm ---- I haven't checked the coil packs or the plugs next on my list and the wheels need a refurb
#32: Re: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: johnpidge, Posted: Wed Mar 04, 2015 11:13 am ---- New coil pack and Bosch plugs seems to be perfect now - sweet if now a little poorer again !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
#33: Re: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: johnpidge, Posted: Wed Mar 04, 2015 3:18 pm ---- oh and it had NGK plugs in it - not sure they are that bad but now has proper Bosch ones
#34: Re: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: johnpidge, Posted: Thu Mar 05, 2015 8:50 am ---- arghhhhhhhhhhh
Lumpy idle returned this morning big time!
Dash came up with the 'catalytic converter fault' - engine light came on - fault reader came up with P0300 Random multiple cylinder misfire detected - few minutes car warmed up and drove fine - still with the engine light on. Started the car after 30 minutes or so and now the dashboard comes up with 'Antipollution fault' - still with the reader giveing me the same P0300 multiple missfire code
What the bloody hells going on - I know its a French car but what !?!?!?!?!?!
I put a new coil pack in it yesterday as well as 4 new Bosch plugs - took it home drove perfectly and gaveit a wash
Any ideas?
#35: Re: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: johnpidge, Posted: Fri Mar 06, 2015 12:02 pm ---- Does the GTi have an autochoke or a starter jet - how would i check this??
#36: Re: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: Addaz, Location: SuffolkPosted: Fri Mar 06, 2015 1:10 pm ---- Its injection so no
Have you checked the compression? Have you checked the injectors?
#37: Re: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: johnpidge, Posted: Fri Mar 06, 2015 1:23 pm ---- Havent checked either - wouldnt either show up a fault code??
#38: Re: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: Addaz, Location: SuffolkPosted: Sat Mar 07, 2015 6:05 am ---- Yes, multiple misfire
#39: Re: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: johnpidge, Posted: Sat Mar 07, 2015 6:31 am ---- Right have used a better code reader and it threw up multiple errors and misfire cyliner two so as its only done this since i replaced the coilpack i swaped it for anotger one from eurocar parts cleaned all the connections etc wd40 spray and cleaned all the contacts on the ecu as someone suggested that
seems to.be running ok - the injector cycle came up.all ok so maybe dodgy coil pack??
#40: Re: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: johnpidge, Posted: Sat Mar 07, 2015 1:41 pm ---- hmmmm
Starts and runs fine but still a lumpy shakey idle at cold start up - once at 70c + it runs sweet and runs very nicely - mpg is good and getting better 24 - 25 mpg in really bad traffic in SW London so its not the lambdas (didnt show any fault on them anyway)
Slightly fed up with my French car now - shame as it really goes well otherwise
#41: Re: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: Addaz, Location: SuffolkPosted: Sat Mar 07, 2015 2:13 pm ---- What are the resistance readings across the injectors?
Are the plugs tight? What are the compression readings?
What are the MAP readings on idle?
#42: Re: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: johnpidge, Posted: Sat Mar 07, 2015 2:19 pm ---- Need to do a compression test
#43: Re: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: johnpidge, Posted: Sat Mar 07, 2015 2:21 pm ---- I will.check the other readings what should the Map readings be??
#44: Re: 206 GTi lumpy idle Author: Addaz, Location: SuffolkPosted: Sun Mar 08, 2015 5:30 am ---- Around 300 to 400 on idle
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