Hi I need help, My son owns a 206 1.1 sport 8 v on an 06 plate.
it has always used water but no signs of head gasket 1 was a leak in to the passenger side foot well "O" rings, then it looked like a slight weep on the radiator about a month ago.
Then he rang me saying the temp had shot up and he put 2 litres of water in it.
a couple of days later it has a slight misfire then on the way home the light of doom.
I plugged in the Mac Tools scanner.
P1337
P0301
both are cylinder 1. I took the oil cap off and we had chocolate shake, I looked in to the breather pipes chocolate shake. I took out plug 1 water on the plug.
Head Gasket.
I phoned the local parts people Macpa in leicester and they sorted all I needed for the change.
Job done cleaned everything the gasket was worse than I would have dreamed it amazed me it was running.
As I took it apart I had done my research and pinned the camshaft as well as marking the bottom crank pulley, so I put it back together with everything lined up but it turned over sounding bad and no fire. I didn't try any more. spent hours resetting it and as soon as I turned it over by hand way out.
I then did loads of searches and found out about the flywheel lock but for the life of me could not find the hole, then I found there are 2 holes and you need the top one behind the oil filter, I then set the cam and then set the crank pin and put the belts back.
This time I have it spinning it has fuel but it does not sound right all the fault codes are clear but it half fires but not any wear near right.
I am lost I have changed head gaskets before and never had anything that has frustrated me to the point of wanting to smash it with the biggest hammer I have before this.
PLEASE HELP.
UPDATE
I did some serious checks no piston or valve damage.
I also checked coil pack and plugs were working.
I checked the valves were opening & Closing when they should.
I checked the wiring and that seems fine
I am lost. Last edited by formula1john on Tue Apr 02, 2019 11:10 pm; edited 3 times in total
#2: Re: Timing won't start Author: gazza82, Location: South BucksPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2019 4:10 pm ---- If it's an interference engine (is the 8v?) you may have damaged the valves if you didn't get the timing right first time .. that head may need to come off again ..
#3: Re: Timing won't start Author: MrBSI, Location: What's it to you? ? ?Posted: Wed Mar 20, 2019 4:13 pm ---- TU1 is an interference engine.
TU1 is a pretty simple engine to time up - do remember the PSA quirk that cylinder number 1 is the GEARBOX end.
#4: Re: Timing won't start Author: formula1john, Location: East Midlands UK EarthPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2019 4:32 pm ----
MrBSI wrote:
TU1 is an interference engine.
TU1 is a pretty simple engine to time up - do remember the PSA quirk that cylinder number 1 is the GEARBOX end.
I did note that before I started but thanks when checking everything there were no marks on any pistons and I have turned the engine over by hand watching the rockers and checking for TDC. what bothers me is the sound I would do a compression check but the one I have wont fit down the tubes for the plugs. when I first thought that there was a problem I followed every bit of advice to check for valve damage and I don't think that it is that. I could be wrong! Oh I have checked each plug and thir is fuel getting in, I just wonder if I am missing something, I also note that the valves were set quite well within the heads they looked as if they wouldn't hit the pistons with an invite from the Queen.
#5: Re: Timing won't start Author: formula1john, Location: East Midlands UK EarthPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2019 4:34 pm ----
gazza82 wrote:
If it's an interference engine (is the 8v?) you may have damaged the valves if you didn't get the timing right first time .. that head may need to come off again ..
Ouch another bill for head bolts I am not 100% sure the valves could hit the pistons they were quite well set in the head.What I do know for sure is that the block had wet liners the heads alloy with the valves sort of recessed they were all working fine and not even a scratch on the pistons I have also been turning the engine over by hand with the plugs removed I have watched the rockers working nothing seems wrong, I believe this car was sent by the devil herself the wife.
#6: Re: Timing won't start Author: formula1john, Location: East Midlands UK EarthPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2019 5:52 pm ---- Some pix of the workplace I have been spending my life in.
This may reveal something I could have missed.
Timing pinned
#7: Re: Timing won't start 206 Sport 1.1 Video Update Author: formula1john, Location: East Midlands UK EarthPosted: Sat Mar 23, 2019 10:00 am ---- Has this given anyone any ideas as to what is wrong???
youtu.be/CXzHIevDZss
#8: Re: Timing won't start 206 Sport 1.1 Video Update Author: Sim, Location: West CountryPosted: Sat Mar 23, 2019 10:41 am ----
It sounds like the battery is getting tired and might not be able to ignite the mixture (especially if it's fuel-flooded). Might be worth jump-starting the battery.
Have you tried the Easy Start spray into the intake?
#9: Re: Timing won't start 206 Sport 1.1 Video Update Author: formula1john, Location: East Midlands UK EarthPosted: Sat Mar 23, 2019 2:40 pm ----
It sounds like the battery is getting tired and might not be able to ignite the mixture (especially if it's fuel-flooded). Might be worth jump-starting the battery.
Have you tried the Easy Start spray into the intake?
Hi thanks for the reply I have tried jumping it a while ago it made no difference then but since i have set the timing 3 times and stripped it back down and put every thing back in it's place to check if I had missed something so I will give that another go when the Mrs gets back with my car. Thanks for the reminder I think sometimes we can overlook the obvious but I just checked the voltage on the battery 12.1volts not that good.
#10: Re: Timing won't start 206 Sport 1.1 Video Update Author: iancav6, Location: rugbyPosted: Sat Mar 23, 2019 6:21 pm ---- Don't know the engine at all but assume it has hydraulic lifters?
Have the lifters expanded while the head and rockers were apart and now you have put together are holding the valves open?
#11: Re: Timing won't start 206 Sport 1.1 Video Update Author: formula1john, Location: East Midlands UK EarthPosted: Sat Mar 23, 2019 6:32 pm ----
iancav6 wrote:
Don't know the engine at all but assume it has hydraulic lifters?
Have the lifters expanded while the head and rockers were apart and now you have put together are holding the valves open?
Thanks for your reply, the rockers are lifted by rollers on the cam shaft it rolls over the cam lobes opening and closing the valves but it was something I hadn't even thought about so not a wasted comment thanks for taking the time to reply.
#12: Re: Timing won't start 206 Sport 1.1 Video Update Author: iancav6, Location: rugbyPosted: Sat Mar 23, 2019 6:37 pm ---- How are the valve clearances controlled?
Manually adjusted?
#13: Re: Timing won't start 206 Sport 1.1 Video Update Author: formula1john, Location: East Midlands UK EarthPosted: Sat Mar 23, 2019 8:16 pm ----
iancav6 wrote:
How are the valve clearances controlled?
Manually adjusted?
Hi yes they are manually adjusted just like the old tappets with the rod lifting them all that has changed is the rod has been replaced with the cam being closer to the rocker arm they have a roller going over the cam lobe pushing the top of the valve to open it, I can see each of the valves opening and closing.
#14: Re: Timing won't start 206 Sport 1.1 Video Update Author: iancav6, Location: rugbyPosted: Sat Mar 23, 2019 8:34 pm ---- Presume you have set the clearances?
#15: Re: Timing won't start 206 Sport 1.1 Video Update Author: formula1john, Location: East Midlands UK EarthPosted: Sat Mar 23, 2019 8:54 pm ----
iancav6 wrote:
Presume you have set the clearances?
They are all within the listed gaps it honestly makes no sense, I have changed head gaskets, set timing, swapped engines, you name it i have never had as much trouble as this is giving me. Even though there was chocolate shake it was still running but rough, cleaned it out changed the gasket and all the supporting gaskets while putting it back together, I have even checked for a spark it was tough but can be done,
If this was an older engine I would have said that the timing was about 180 degrees out but as there is only 1 way to time it by putting a cam pin and another in the flywheel it can't be that.
#16: Re: Timing won't start 206 Sport 1.1 Video Update Author: MrBSI, Location: What's it to you? ? ?Posted: Sun Mar 24, 2019 12:49 pm ---- FWIW: The TU1 engine in a 206 uses a wasted spark ignition system so the spark plugs will fire on the COMPRESSION & also EXHAUST stroke.
#17: Re: Timing won't start 206 Sport 1.1 Video Update Author: formula1john, Location: East Midlands UK EarthPosted: Sun Mar 24, 2019 4:13 pm ----
MrBSI wrote:
FWIW: The TU1 engine in a 206 uses a wasted spark ignition system so the spark plugs will fire on the COMPRESSION & also EXHAUST stroke.
Now that is something I didn't know, So in theory any fuel left in the engine would cause some sort of back fire that would lead me to think of older engines being 180 degrees out of timing. well at least now I know I am not insane. I have the timing right by the pins I have taken the whole thing back and re-fitted it again. Why does it sound like in the video I have tried jumping it I did the beep test. I truly am at a loss as to why it will not start.
#18: Re: Timing won't start 206 Sport 1.1 Video Update Author: iancav6, Location: rugbyPosted: Sun Mar 24, 2019 8:34 pm ---- The cranking sounds uneven, can you get hold of a compression tester?
#19: Re: Timing won't start 206 Sport 1.1 Video Update Author: formula1john, Location: East Midlands UK EarthPosted: Sun Mar 24, 2019 9:19 pm ----
iancav6 wrote:
The cranking sounds uneven, can you get hold of a compression tester?
Believe it or not I have one but it won't fit this car I have been in touch with some mates but they all have used mine and never purchased one.
My lad is waiting to hear from a couple of his mates but most have the IQ of a gnat so probability says they take their cars to a local backstreet mechanic or Kwik-Fit.
You are right though it does seem to be out of wack.
#20: Re: Timing won't start 206 Sport 1.1 Video Update Author: MrBSI, Location: What's it to you? ? ?Posted: Mon Mar 25, 2019 4:42 am ---- Has a new timing belt been fitted?
If you have did you double check the belt as there are TWO different belts for the 206 TU1 engine, one has 100 teeth & the other 104 teeth depending on engine age.
#21: Re: Timing won't start 206 Sport 1.1 Video Update Author: formula1john, Location: East Midlands UK EarthPosted: Mon Mar 25, 2019 7:22 am ----
MrBSI wrote:
Has a new timing belt been fitted?
If you have did you double check the belt as there are TWO different belts for the 206 TU1 engine, one has 100 teeth & the other 104 teeth depending on engine age.
No i have not fitted a new belt as it had one fitted about a year ago. The only changes I made were gaskets, this is my dilemma.
#22: Re: Timing won't start 206 Sport 1.1 Video Update Author: formula1john, Location: East Midlands UK EarthPosted: Tue Mar 26, 2019 1:59 pm ---- Todays update I spent some time on the 206 1.1 Sport 2006 trying to think of why it turns over but does not sound right and I also tried a few other things. and I would like to thank everyone who makes any suggestion no matter how trivial or wacky you think it may be anything can help as you all should know.
First I set the jump leads up and let it just drain the life out of my car. at this point I was looking at the voltage meter I fitted a while ago, as I turned the 206 over it dropped below 11 volts So I have now taken the battery off and put it on charge. I have not been able to get my hands on a compression tester yet.
I then decided to check the timing pins still line up. First I was doing this on my own so it was a little bit of a pain but starting with the flywheel I got the pin to drop in to its hole to find that the cam wheel hole was in the mirrored position where there is no hole so I pulled the flywheel pin out and continued to slowly move the cam wheel in to position and bingo both pins in. I just never had that before is this normal does anyone know as I cant remember seeing the holes even when I changed the clutch?
Any way not doing anything else until the battery is charged as it wouldn't jump or hit the voltage of my car as the battery was draining it the output of my car is 14.2 connect the 206 the most it would hit was 13 dead.
Please keep the advice coming.
Much appreciated John
#23: Re: Timing won't start 206 Sport 1.1 Video Update Author: formula1john, Location: East Midlands UK EarthPosted: Thu Mar 28, 2019 7:22 pm ---- Well today I attacked the earthing of the car and put a fully charged battery on it.
It span over well but sort of back fired as I hit the throttle, the only signs of almost life are as i hit the throttle the rest is mainly turning over until I get some sort of half hearted back fire. The plugs smell of petrol when I take them out but I have also plugged all the plugs in to the coil pack earthed all the plugs using a long stripped copper wire and they have sparks so I know they work.
Any ideas apart from adding fuel and a match.
#24: Re: Timing won't start 206 Sport 1.1 Video Update Author: iancav6, Location: rugbyPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2019 6:28 am ---- You say the car overheated, has it warped the head?
Did you check it was flat?
As a rough cam timing check can you get it to tdc on cyl 1 or 4 ,observing piston through the plug hole and check the valves are on overlap, i.e. inlet and exhaust are both rocking on one of the cyls.
Still think you need to verify the compressions.
What about a blocked exhaust, damaged cat?
Go back to the basics for it to run;
Fuel
Spark
Compression
Airflow
Sorry if I'm insulting your intelligence, just shooting ideas around.
#25: Re: Timing won't start 206 Sport 1.1 Video Update Author: formula1john, Location: East Midlands UK EarthPosted: Sat Mar 30, 2019 11:03 am ----
iancav6 wrote:
You say the car overheated, has it warped the head?
Did you check it was flat?
As a rough cam timing check can you get it to tdc on cyl 1 or 4 ,observing piston through the plug hole and check the valves are on overlap, i.e. inlet and exhaust are both rocking on one of the cyls.
Still think you need to verify the compressions.
What about a blocked exhaust, damaged cat?
Go back to the basics for it to run;
Fuel
Spark
Compression
Airflow
Sorry if I'm insulting your intelligence, just shooting ideas around.
I did check the head with a steel ruler it was flat as a pancake, I didn't see any thing with the exhaust apart from it being a pig to get back together, I will check for a blockage.
I did set her at TDC and was watching the valves but didn't watch for overlap I shall do that. I think you have hit the nail on the head back to basics is all I can do, I have been pushed to my limits trying to see what is wrong like I said I earthed the plugs with wire as it has the single coil pack like a bar, and checked it for spark.
Trust me you are not insulting me anything is better than no ideas.
#26: Re: Timing won't start 206 Sport 1.1 Thread Ended Author: formula1john, Location: East Midlands UK EarthPosted: Tue Apr 02, 2019 11:05 pm ---- I have labeled this Thread Ended as with my lad's job he couldn't wait for an eternity for me to find a solution as he needs it for work. Even talking to genuine mechanics who know this car said my only course of action was looking expensive with diagnostics not helping and the fact I have done what they would have done to replace the head gasket.
So we have more french in the family since the 206 has gone to the car park in the sky My boy has his first TURBO, a Citroen C3 SXHDI 70 1.4 Diesel The snail you see under the bonnet is Mahoosive
I still thank you all that have shot ideas with me it aided me in checking that I had not left anything to chance
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My boy has his first TURBO, a Citroen C3 SXHDI 70 1.4 Diesel The snail you see under the bonnet is Mahoosive 
