#1: Temp goes through the roof & no a/c now Author: Dannyskittles, Location: WalsallPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 1:33 am ---- Hi guys great job your doing with the forum, been reading a lot of info on here and it's been very interesting. I have a problem and was wondering if you guys could help. The misses and I brought a 206 recently and on a journey the other day the temp went through the roof and eventually the engine light come on. So stopped and waited until it cooled down, we was stuck in traffic. I can't hear the fan kicking in, and also the a/c has stopped working just blows hot air. It did work when we brought the car. But to keep temp down in traffic have to have the heaters full on hot which cooks me in this hot weather, I was wondering if you guys had any info? If you need more to go on then please ask and I will try my best, it's a 1.4 8v on a v plate. 1991. Also where the pipe attaches to the coolant bottle the clip has come off so the hose is jut pushed on, but it hasn't leaked only once or when temp goes above 100. But I top it up and it lowers abit. Sits at about 90 while on motorway or driving constantly but don't like sitting in traffic and rises really quickly. Thanks guys and info would be much appreciated
Dan
#2: Re: Temp goes through the roof & no a/c now Author: DJ-, Location: UKPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 2:00 am ---- A few topics on this recently. check the connections regarding the fan:
#3: Re: Temp goes through the roof & no a/c now Author: Dannyskittles, Location: WalsallPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 3:36 am ---- Cheers will give it ago, just a pain in the a**e that you have to remove bumper.
#4: Re: Temp goes through the roof & no a/c now Author: DJ-, Location: UKPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 3:40 am ---- Na you can access the area without removing the whole bumper. Just remove the top grill area above the bumper/under the lights.
#5: Re: Temp goes through the roof & no a/c now Author: Edward, Location: In the garagePosted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 3:55 am ---- You can check the relay connections with the bumper in place. If anything needs fixing it's easier if you remove the bumper.
#6: Re: Temp goes through the roof & no a/c now Author: MrBSI, Location: What's it to you? ? ?Posted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 4:08 am ----
Dannyskittles wrote:
just a pain in the a**e that you have to remove bumper.
Front bumper takes less then 5 minutes to remove on a 206 with the right tools.
#7: Re: Temp goes through the roof & no a/c now Author: Edward, Location: In the garagePosted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 4:22 am ---- If the bolts on the wings aren't seized...
#8: Re: Temp goes through the roof & no a/c now Author: Dannyskittles, Location: WalsallPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 5:27 am ---- Everything on this car is seized lol. Well I'll put it on some axle stands and have a look. See if I can see anything and then start removing anything in my way great help so far cheers guys
#9: Re: Temp goes through the roof & no a/c now Author: Mr206HDI, Location: MidlandsPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 6:29 am ---- Had some problems with my 206 and overheating when I brought it. I knew this to be the case at the time of purchasing and was prepared to fix it all the way to the head gasket if necessary as the condition of the car was worth the work. Bloody bargain it was too LOL.
First point of checking for us was the fan and we found that all the wiring concerned with the fan was corroded and crumbled when disturbed so be prepared to have to extend and replace wires / connections.
We ended up using male and female bullet connectors to extend broken wires and spade connector females to make new connections to the relays etc.
It's not a hard job. Just takes a bit of time and patience.
#10: Re: Temp goes through the roof & no a/c now Author: Edward, Location: In the garagePosted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 6:51 am ---- If all the wiring it past its best then I'd just remove it right back to the earth behind the bumpers and the fuse box.
#11: Re: Temp goes through the roof & no a/c now Author: kandlbarrett, Location: SwindonPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 7:13 am ---- Dannskittles: if you haven't got one already you will need a wiring diagram to help with this. You may get lucky and find it just by disconnecting and reconnecting but the fan / air conditioning circuit is not a simple one on these and there are individual components and connectors that are used for the control of both the air conditioning and fan motor so I imagine the fault is related.
I think you will find the diagram on the www somewhere, I know I did but haven't kept it, but for example there are four fuses
F7, F21, F37 and F38 that all supply power to these systems. Start by checking those.
After that there are all the connections, the low speed fan relay and fan resistor.
However, again the previous advice, get a circuit diagram and a multi-meter. If you don't then good luck fault finding it could turn out to be time consuming.
#12: Re: Temp goes through the roof & no a/c now Author: Edward, Location: In the garagePosted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 7:15 am ---- The fan wiring is really simple on these cars. No need for a wiring diagram.
#13: Re: Temp goes through the roof & no a/c now Author: Dannyskittles, Location: WalsallPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 7:25 am ---- Well taking it apart tomorrow morning, so hopefully will be sorted by tomorrow afternoon and will post updates and try and get a few pics might help people out abit. So will keep you updated.
#14: Re: Temp goes through the roof & no a/c now Author: GTI_89, Location: NewcastlePosted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 7:52 am ---- ill say 90% that its the fan relays.
i had the exact same problem, both relays wer coroded very badly which also caused a wire to snap.
2 new relays and some new wire and al sortd, cooling fan an a/c fan work perfectly.
i didnt have a front grill in at the time which made it very easy just keep your hands away from the fan
#15: Re: Temp goes through the roof & no a/c now Author: lofty, Location: Near ManchesterPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 9:21 am ---- I had this too. Easy/cheap to fix.
#16: Re: Temp goes through the roof & no a/c now Author: Dannyskittles, Location: WalsallPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 10:19 am ---- Well I just hope it's the relays and abit of wiring and I don't have to replace the whole unit. Do I get the relays from Peugeot themselves or anywhere else I could get them?
#17: Re: Temp goes through the roof & no a/c now Author: Dannyskittles, Location: WalsallPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 10:20 am ---- Oh and cheers for all the help guys much appreciated.
#18: Re: Temp goes through the roof & no a/c now Author: GTI_89, Location: NewcastlePosted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 10:47 am ---- get the relays from pug, they aint to expensive.
can you turn the fan by hand? if so it isnt seized and id go straight for the relays tbh
#19: Re: Temp goes through the roof & no a/c now Author: kandlbarrett, Location: SwindonPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 11:25 am ---- Dannyskittle: if you are going to do this by changing components (I am tight and hate doing it that way) rather than fault finding then:-
1. Check the fuses that I listed first.
2. Check all the connections, unplug them and then plug them back in. That should be enough to clean any corrosion from the connections.
3. Look closely at the wiring to make sure it isn't badly corroded.
4. Replace the relays.
Hopefully it is simple and component changing will fix it - if I was to put money on it I would bet in order:-
Low speed fan relay.
Earth for Fan / aircon control unit.
Bad connection.
Fan resistor (rheostat) or connection.
For those who think the circuit is simple have them explain exactly how the two speed switching works and exactly how the aircon / fan control unit works. NOTE: the earth path for the relay coils is via the aircon / fan control unit. Last edited by kandlbarrett on Sun Apr 01, 2012 12:16 pm; edited 1 time in total
#20: Re: Temp goes through the roof & no a/c now Author: GTI_89, Location: NewcastlePosted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 11:29 am ---- get the relays from pug, they aint to expensive.
can you turn the fan by hand? if so it isnt seized and id go straight for the relays tbh
#21: Re: Temp goes through the roof & no a/c now Author: kandlbarrett, Location: SwindonPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 12:35 pm ---- Unplug the green temperature sensor. If the fan cuts in at high speed it is either the low speed circuit fuse (F38), the low speed relay, fan resistor, broken wire or bad connection.
If it doesn't cut in at all it is either the main fan fuse (MF2), fan ECU fuse (F37), fan relay, fan / aircon ECU earth, temperature sensor, fan, bad connections or broken wires.
After the initial test above the order of checking is still as previous post.
#22: Re: Temp goes through the roof & no a/c now Author: Dannyskittles, Location: WalsallPosted: Sun May 13, 2012 8:47 am ---- Ok so finally got round to it, the relays snapped off, in the connectors, so dunno what to do there can I buy the whole lot, and also obviously it's been like this for a while because fan is really stiff, so off to pug to get fan and relays, but only worry is, is the relay pins are corroded into the connectors, wire them straight to the relays?
#23: Re: Temp goes through the roof & no a/c now Author: Deckchair5, Location: Bath UKPosted: Sun May 13, 2012 10:29 am ---- Maybe consider something like this as the relays come with connectors and fly leads to go straight in. You could install the relays somewhere less exposed then too <<click here
#24: Re: Temp goes through the roof & no a/c now Author: Dannyskittles, Location: WalsallPosted: Sun May 13, 2012 6:09 pm ---- Yeah going to extend the wires anyway I think and put them up by ecu, as where they are behind the bumper is the worst place. Looks like I need a new resistor as it basically crumbled in my hand. Problem after problem, thanks for the reply.
#25: Re: Temp goes through the roof & no a/c now Author: Dannyskittles, Location: WalsallPosted: Mon May 14, 2012 4:04 pm ---- Ok Guys really need your help, relays changed and rewired, resistor changed, fan works as I tested this by connecting straight to battery and it spins fine, so tested the car by starting it and letting it getto temp, but it had hardly reached 90 when the water bottle started over flowing, as the preasure was to great and started to boil out the top, so what is the engine actually hotter then what it's reading? But fan didn't kick in and the slow speed fan didn't come on when I pressed the air con button, And left it on for 5 mins, can someone tell me next steps in basically what I should do next? Thanks guys
#26: Re: Temp goes through the roof & no a/c now Author: Deckchair5, Location: Bath UKPosted: Tue May 15, 2012 6:56 am ---- If the engine coolant is boiling but the engine temp sensor isn't seeing it then maybe you have an airlock near the ETS. If the ETS is getting coolant but it's not showing high temp then ETS isn't good. If there's no engine hot water getting to the ETS then maybe the thermostat is jammed in the closed position
Feel the top hose going to the radiator from the thermostat housing. If it's not getting hot when engine is up to temp then you have no water flow so either airlock or jammed thermostat
If there's no flow at all or poor flow then there's the possibility of corroded vanes on the water pump
#27: Re: Temp goes through the roof & no a/c now Author: Dannyskittles, Location: WalsallPosted: Wed May 16, 2012 7:02 am ---- The top hose gets hot, and the bottom hose gets hot, so there is flow, and I checked the for an air lock, well just coolant was coming out then topped up, no air what so ever, should I replace the ets? An see what that does? But surely the ets wouldn't matter when turning air con on? Surely the low speed fan should have come on?
#28: Re: Temp goes through the roof & no a/c now Author: Deckchair5, Location: Bath UKPosted: Wed May 16, 2012 10:38 am ---- The top hose gets hot, and the bottom hose gets hot, so there is flow,
yes so that's good and shows pump is working and thermostat is opening
and I checked the for an air lock, well just coolant was coming out then topped up, no air what so ever,
ok so that's good too but the question is why is gauge showing 90C when engine is boiling over?
should I replace the ets?
very possibly but you could check resistance at temps to see if it is telling lies or whether it's telling the truth and save yourself unnecessary expense
But surely the ets wouldn't matter when turning air con on? Surely the low speed fan should have come on?
That's correct
Many cars have two coolant temp sensors, one for dash gauge and rad fans (usually green) and the other for aircon (usually brown) .
If you disconnect the brown one does rad fan come on?
Has the engine overheated and head gasket gone? High coolant pressure and temperature are signs of head gasket failure
#29: Re: Temp goes through the roof & no a/c now Author: Dannyskittles, Location: WalsallPosted: Wed May 16, 2012 11:10 am ---- Don't think its the head gasket, as no signs, I mean the oil is fine, no gunky white stuff, I know sometimes you don't get that but just seems fine,
As for air con sensor well the air con light comes on but it makes no difference it's still warm, it just stopped working a while ago, thought it need re gasing and never got around to it, so what does this brown sensor do then? So if I unplug that, then turn aircon on, if it's working the fan should come on? So how would that brown sensor stop it? Sorry I just like to know what stuff does. But obviously I'm not getting high speed fan either as car boils, at 90 so I switch it off, how high should it get before high speed kicks in? As all this aircon stuff shouldnt affect the high speed fan should it? As don't they run on sort of separate systems?
#30: Re: Temp goes through the roof & no a/c now Author: Deckchair5, Location: Bath UKPosted: Wed May 16, 2012 2:03 pm ---- Don't think its the head gasket, as no signs, I mean the oil is fine, no gunky white stuff, I know sometimes you don't get that but just seems fine,
I hope it isn't too but it depends what channels are bridged with a failed head gasket. If it's oilway to coolant then you get the oil/coolant mix of the milky white stuff. If it's bridged between the compression bore and the coolant then you get over pressurised and extremely hot coolant all happening very quickly after start up with no affect on oil. It all depends what you're experiencing
If you've had no rad fan working on either low or high for a while then you are very likely to have over temped at some point, that will depend on your known history
AIRCON
If your air con needs regassing and it's insufficient for the compressor to be allowed to start then that will be why the rad fan doesn't start up either when you select air con. The pressurestat gives the ok for both to start
The brown coolant temp sensor is just for the air con system. Disconnecting it, purely as a test, will normally put the rad fan on high speed so it's a way of testing that side of the system
#31: Re: Temp goes through the roof & no a/c now Author: Dannyskittles, Location: WalsallPosted: Wed May 16, 2012 2:48 pm ---- It don't happen quickly thou, from cold to 90 takes about 15 mins maybe more, that's not driving, driving it reaches temp normally, ok so I'll get the air con re gassed and go from there, and in the mean time I'll unplug the air con sensor and see if the fan will spin, hopefully it will but I'm not getting high speed fan when driving anyway, plus when I'm driving my temp stays at 70, but I only have to stop in traffics for 8 - 10 mins and it's going over 90, and I have to put car heaters on full and open windows or pull over,
Cars doing my head in now, just want to start again, new loom, new rad, new fan, new engine lol but hey might as well buy a new car. Peugeot wanted 60 for the rad loom, and 140 for the fan and motor, I don't know how they can justify this, I had a go at the bloke when I brought the relays, I know it wasn't his fault but I wanted to have a rant at someone,
#32: Re: Temp goes through the roof & no a/c now Author: Deckchair5, Location: Bath UKPosted: Wed May 16, 2012 11:59 pm ---- OK well that doesn't sound so much like head gasket gone, the more details you provide then the more accurate the responses
At 90C the engine thermostat is only just opening so the rad fan won't start on low speed until around 95-97C as it's not needed
To find whether your fans are going to work without taking the engine temp up tp dangerous levels then you could use a simple variable resistor in place of the ETS and then you could simulate your engine going to any temp you like
For the moment, while you are sorting the problem, you could simply make your rad fan run at low or high speed continuously so it doesn't ever get to too high temps. The engine thermostat will make sure the engine still gets to the correct running temperature
If the coolant passing by the ETS is over boiling point but the ETS isn't sensing it over temp then there's something wrong with the ETS circuit
#33: Re: Temp goes through the roof & no a/c now Author: Dannyskittles, Location: WalsallPosted: Thu May 17, 2012 8:41 am ---- That was my last resort, to wire fan up So is on all the time, but then I was unsure because of engine getting up to temp, but you say it will anyway? As the thermo will do that? And how would I do that? By just using the low speed relay? As I'd have to take it from the battery?
To be honest it's doing my head in now, car has just passed mot thou so it's decent enough, so don't really want to get rid, I'm changing the ets today, and going to start stripping stuff off and see if I can find any faults, am I missing a fuse maybe? Iv checked the obvious, and what someone said in the previous post, maybe I'm missing one?
#34: Re: Temp goes through the roof & no a/c now Author: Deckchair5, Location: Bath UKPosted: Fri May 18, 2012 12:49 am ---- That was my last resort, to wire fan up So is on all the time, but then I was unsure because of engine getting up to temp, but you say it will anyway? As the thermo will do that?
Yes the engine thermostat will take care of engine temp, the radiator and rad fan is only needed for the excess temps
And how would I do that? By just using the low speed relay? As I'd have to take it from the battery?
Just supply a fused 12v supply to the slow speed resistor on the non fan side and you will have low speed fan on permanently with ignition on
#35: Re: Temp goes through the roof & no a/c now Author: fliss76, Posted: Mon May 19, 2014 8:28 am ---- i have had same problem so changed the wiring loom for the radiator fan relays & changed the resister switch for the radiator. fans all work fine now but this has caused a fault with the roof mechanism & now the roof wont work & constant beeping noise. can anyone help plz
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