#1: Engine Starting Problem - (Occasionally) Author: hamed206, Location: EgyptPosted: Sun Sep 02, 2012 6:41 am ---- It happens occasionally, the engine turns but don't start, it will struggle and refuse to start until I try many time and unplug the battery cable many times too. I suspect the unplugging and re plugging of the battery cable has nothing to do with the problem as it sometimes struggle for few minutes then start without having to unplug and replug the cable.
The engine performance also became so bad.
Today it was the worst time, it refused to start for 15 minutes, then after some trials it started, but I noted the engine performance became worse than before.
I suspect the following:
-Fuel pump (because of the poor performance).
-Crank sensor, but as my knowledge, crank sensor can only cause the starting up issue, it has nothing to do with the performance, right? Although if the crank is faulty, would it refuses to start for several time, and start after too many trials or it will refuse for ever to start?
The car don't cut-out while driving. And don't hesitate or something. It just refuses to start, and this happenn from time to time, the engine turns but don't start for a while.
PS: my spark plugs are new as well as the fuel filter. My ECU is recondition one from ebay, and the coil is Bugicord.
Appreciate advises.
Thanks.
#2: Re: Engine Starting Problem - (Occasionally) Author: jackspaniels, Location: gloucestershirePosted: Sun Sep 02, 2012 2:00 pm ---- what engine have you got? and what year?
#3: Re: Engine Starting Problem - (Occasionally) Author: V9977, Location: Athens, GreecePosted: Sun Sep 02, 2012 8:58 pm ---- Have you checked all the earth points as well as main battery earth straps are secure?
There is also an earth point near the ECU that can cause this.
#4: Re: Engine Starting Problem - (Occasionally) Author: Deckchair5, Location: Bath UKPosted: Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:03 am ---- The car don't cut-out while driving. And don't hesitate or something. It just refuses to start, and this happen from time to time, the engine turns but don't start for a while.
Sounds like crank sensor
Although if the crank is faulty, would it refuses to start for several time, and start after too many trials or it will refuse for ever to start?
The engine will turn but not have any sign of life and only after many attempts it will start as if nothing was ever wrong. Why? It has suddenly found the crank position so only then will it allow fuel and ignition to happen. So that sounds like your symptoms
#5: Re: Engine Starting Problem - (Occasionally) Author: hamed206, Location: EgyptPosted: Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:37 am ----
Deckchair5 wrote:
The car don't cut-out while driving. And don't hesitate or something. It just refuses to start, and this happen from time to time, the engine turns but don't start for a while.
Sounds like crank sensor
Although if the crank is faulty, would it refuses to start for several time, and start after too many trials or it will refuse for ever to start?
The engine will turn but not have any sign of life and only after many attempts it will start as if nothing was ever wrong. Why? It has suddenly found the crank position so only then will it allow fuel and ignition to happen. So that sounds like your symptoms
Thanks.
Sounds like a crank sensor for me too. I ordered one any way. The current one has done 70K kilometers.
Another thing, will the crank sensor effect the performance/speed of the car?
#6: Re: Engine Starting Problem - (Occasionally) Author: Deckchair5, Location: Bath UKPosted: Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:44 am ---- Another thing, will the crank sensor effect the performance/speed of the car?
Nowhere near as much because once the ECU knows the rpm when the engine is running, it doesn't matter if the crank sensor misses a signal now and again. But at start up it's critical for ignition/ fuel injection timing to know where the crank rotation is exactly and it needs a minimum rpm before it will allow fuel/ignition to happen. Without that minimum rpm then it's a non starter
#7: Re: Engine Starting Problem - (Occasionally) Author: hamed206, Location: EgyptPosted: Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:48 am ---- Good Analysis.
Do you think the non-OEM sensors can be good?
I have two options: getting new one "FACET" or Used one.
Cheers.
#8: Re: Engine Starting Problem - (Occasionally) Author: Deckchair5, Location: Bath UKPosted: Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:57 am ---- A crank sensor is a crank sensor regardless of who makes it so they either work or they don't but they do tend to break down on higher mileage so fitting a used one of unknown mileage is only something to do for testing purposes as they aren't too expensive to buy
#9: Re: Engine Starting Problem - (Occasionally) Author: hamed206, Location: EgyptPosted: Mon Sep 03, 2012 3:03 am ----
Deckchair5 wrote:
A crank sensor is a crank sensor regardless of who makes it so they either work or they don't but they do tend to break down on higher mileage so fitting a used one of unknown mileage is only something to do for testing purposes as they aren't too expensive to buy
I have a used one, I keep it for testing purposes. Will try it today.
But I still can't figure out why the engine is hesitating.
Thank you v much.
#10: Re: Engine Starting Problem - (Occasionally) Author: jackspaniels, Location: gloucestershirePosted: Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:40 pm ---- The crank sensor will not affect the engine performance once running. So unless you have two problems, it must be something else. No engine management light on?
Could be coolant temperature sensor.
You need to take a look at the spark plugs to see what colour they are.
#11: Re: Engine Starting Problem - (Occasionally) Author: Deckchair5, Location: Bath UKPosted: Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:57 pm ---- The crank sensor will not affect the engine performance once running.
That's interesting. How do you think the ECU finds out the engine rpm or when to inject fuel or ignition timing? Last edited by Deckchair5 on Mon Sep 03, 2012 4:53 pm; edited 1 time in total
#12: Re: Engine Starting Problem - (Occasionally) Author: hamed206, Location: EgyptPosted: Mon Sep 03, 2012 3:28 pm ---- According to wikipedia:
The functional objective for the crankshaft position sensor is to determine the position and/or rotational speed (RPM) of the crank. Engine Control Units use the information transmitted by the sensor to control parameters such as ignition timing and fuel injection timing. The sensor output can also be related to other sensor data including the cam position to derive the current combustion cycle, this is very important for the starting of a four stroke engine.
A bad crank position sensor can worsen the way the engine idles, the pistons fire, or the acceleration behavior. If the engine is revved up with a bad or faulty sensor, it may cause misfiring, motor vibration or backfires. Accelerating might be hesitant, and abnormal shaking during engine idle might occur. In the worst case the car may not start.
#13: Re: Engine Starting Problem - (Occasionally) Author: hamed206, Location: EgyptPosted: Mon Sep 03, 2012 3:28 pm ---- Anyway, I have fitted a used one for testing, will try it for 1-2 days and see if the problem disappeared. Will then report to you.
Thanks all.
#14: Re: Engine Starting Problem - (Occasionally) Author: hamed206, Location: EgyptPosted: Tue Sep 04, 2012 2:57 am ---- The engine started today very smooth. It seems the problem is sorted out after replacing the crank sensor with a used one.
It is time now to get a new crank sensor but with confidence
I wanted to inform you to sustain the correct solution.
Thanks to all contributors of this topic & special thanks to Deckchair5
BR.
M
#15: Re: Engine Starting Problem - (Occasionally) Author: Deckchair5, Location: Bath UKPosted: Tue Sep 04, 2012 7:26 am ---- Good stuff
Isn't it peculiar though, today i got an engine stopping on me whilst driving at speed and fault code logged was P0335 engine crank sensor circuit A malfunction. Ha! Cleaned up the contacts with electrical cleaner and everything seems fine now but it may be time for me to buy a new CKP sensor too
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