#1: Totally dead - but random! Author: mbc007, Posted: Wed Sep 26, 2012 11:37 am ---- HI - i'm new here so please be gentle!
Wwe have a petrol 1.4, 2003 206.
Wifey took the kids to school this morning, all fine. Came to start the car to come back home and nothing happneded.
I go to rescue her and find that the think is completely dead - no central locking, no interior lights, no dash lights, nothing. No clicks or anything on turning ignition - jsut totally dead.
I get the bonnet up and disconnect battery and reconnect it just a couple of seconds later. Everything then works fine again - car starts and runs fine.
Wifey then uses the car for running about different palces today - again all fine but has now just come to go out again and exaclty same problem occurs.
Again, i disconnect/reconnect battery and everyhtng fine again.
Trouble is, wifey now has no confidecne in the thing and i'm at a loss as to waht the problem is. Any clues anyone?
thanks all
#2: Re: Totally dead - but random! Author: Seabook, Posted: Wed Sep 26, 2012 12:00 pm ---- check earthing point
#3: Re: Totally dead - but random! Author: mbc007, Posted: Wed Sep 26, 2012 12:17 pm ---- thanks - where will i find that?
#4: Re: Totally dead - but random! Author: MrZiggerz, Location: Milton KeynesPosted: Wed Sep 26, 2012 12:23 pm ---- I've found that my Negative is on a stupid push connector, comes off quite often, even when it feels tight.
#5: Re: Totally dead - but random! Author: mbc007, Posted: Wed Sep 26, 2012 12:28 pm ---- I'm certain it's not a loose connection on the terminals.
The fault was rectified by disconecting then reconnecting the battery, either by coincidence or otherwise.
#6: Re: Totally dead - but random! Author: Dillon, Location: KentPosted: Wed Sep 26, 2012 1:00 pm ---- There are a couple of earthing points (gearbox, engine..) but they have a habit of corroding with out any sign, get them off and have a good look over them new strap wont cost the earth... you see what I did there
#7: Re: Totally dead - but random! Author: mbc007, Posted: Wed Sep 26, 2012 1:03 pm ---- yes, very clever!
the electrics is not my strong point but i'll have a go at most things.
Can you just direct me to where i will find these straps and what they look like really! - is it a coated cable?
Do you (does anyone) have the engine schematic showing where they are located?
thanks for all your help
#8: Re: Totally dead - but random! Author: mbc007, Posted: Wed Sep 26, 2012 1:14 pm ---- Ok, so i'm doing a bit of research on this and have conflicting results.
I've seen it suggested that a faulty earth strap will still result in the engine turning over but not firing up; other results seem consistent with my problem - i.e. totally dead - nothing works whatsoever.
Which is right, please?
#9: Re: Totally dead - but random! Author: Dillon, Location: KentPosted: Wed Sep 26, 2012 1:18 pm ---- Actually both of them... not really helping there, it depends on which of the straps is playing up. take the battery out and the battery box off you will see them clearly then. Also whilst your there check the +ve too had this before and it turned out the battery clamp was slightly loose and causeing the battery to move, the +ve would only just touch the terminal.
Do i have to get under the car to locate the fixing to the chasis/gearbox or can i view it all from above?
Presumably i'm chcking that the contact points are not corroded, snapped, etc?
#11: Re: Totally dead - but random! Author: mbc007, Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 3:11 am ---- Update -
Have been out this morning - car seemed fine but have still removed battery and checked the earthing strap.
I could easily see it connected to gearbox and car body - it seemed fine, not corroded or worn or anything.
REconneced battery and perfored a BSI reset.
Car seems fine still but i'm still cautious here as i don't seem to have rectifed anything when doing all this.
Anymore suggestions anyone? I hate these damn intermittent faults!
thanks all
#12: Re: Totally dead - but random! Author: Matt, Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 3:41 am ---- Scrap it?
Sell it?
Part exchange it?
#13: Re: Totally dead - but random! Author: mbc007, Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 3:44 am ---- Thanks Matt - i was looking for something a tad more constructive - can't have the missus hankering after a new motor!
#14: Re: Totally dead - but random! Author: PugJH, Location: NorthantsPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 7:26 am ---- Starter motor?
#15: Re: Totally dead - but random! Author: mbc007, Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 7:27 am ---- No. the issue was no juice whatsover - no central locking, no lights, no wipers, no clicking - zilch !
#16: Re: Totally dead - but random! Author: Matt, Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 1:56 pm ----
mbc007 wrote:
Thanks Matt - i was looking for something a tad more constructive - can't have the missus hankering after a new motor!
That's the bedt advice I can give pal. If its intermittent it could be many things. I bet it hasn't popped up the EML. Which in turn won't give you any codes to work with.
So apart from throwing money at it replacing parts in the hope one of them works, there is not much you can do.
#17: Re: Totally dead - but random! Author: Addaz, Location: SuffolkPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 1:59 pm ---- Its just a poor live connection, happened to our 206 ages ago
Check all the connections at fuse board and battery.
#18: Re: Totally dead - but random! Author: mbc007, Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 2:20 pm ---- Can it be many things?
I would have thought a total lack of juice would limit the problem somewhat?
I've tightened the connections on the battery and checked the live feed to the fuse board - that seemed fine as well.
It's been fine today but then i've been working from home all day. You can gurantee that when i'm not around tomorrow, and the missus is on her own, the f**king thing will break down on her again and i'll have my day interrupted!
thanks for all your help anyway
M
#19: Re: Totally dead - but random! Author: Addaz, Location: SuffolkPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 2:39 pm ---- Apart from a completely and utterly dead battery what else could it be? As If you literally have nothing, the alternator doesnt hold any charge in its windings it can literally only be the battery connection
Clean the battery terminals and see if the connection is loose, as does it not jump out at you that once you fiddled with the battery connection it then started?
#20: Re: Totally dead - but random! Author: mbc007, Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 3:38 pm ---- Hi Addaz.
The battery is fine - it's only 3 mths old and it's holding charge ok.
I'm inclined to think it must be the battery connections but i have to say they seemed attached sufficiently when i disconnected then reconnected them.
Anyway, i've made sure they are now firmly attached and will see how things develop!
#21: Re: Totally dead - but random! Author: V9977, Location: Athens, GreecePosted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 3:50 pm ---- 1) Check the earth-straps (negative wires) from the battery to the chassis/gearbox.
Should be all present and very-tightly fitted without obvious signs of rot or corrosion at the ends.
2) Then start looking at the engine to cabin connector (under LHS wheel-arch) for proper contact
and use contact spray on it, and as many connectors as you can everywhere on the vehicle.
(make sure battery is disconnected for this).
3) I know what you mean about your boss.
#22: Re: Totally dead - but random! Author: mbc007, Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 3:57 pm ---- Hi v9977.
thanks for this.
You mention earth straps (plural). When i had the battery box off today i could only see the one that ran from the gearbox to the chassis. Are there others?
that engine/cabin one - how do i find that? You mention the LHS wheelarch. Is it clearly visible there?
#23: Re: Totally dead - but random! Author: V9977, Location: Athens, GreecePosted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 4:07 pm ---- There is a single thick gauge wire coming off the -ve battery to the gearbox, and another thick gauge from
there to the starter/chassis etc that's what I meant. It should be v.tightly bolted on there and not rotten at the point of fitment.
IF everything appears OK there, the engine to cabin loom has a big round connector under the LHS wheel arch which get's tons of water and dirt so is worth checking that. On a 1.4i there is a square flap on the plastic wheel arch which can be un-clipped just for inspecting and a quick move-around of the connector.
#24: Re: Totally dead - but random! Author: mbc007, Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 4:18 pm ---- Great, thanks.
Those earth straps seemed fine when i looked today.
I'll check that cabin loom. Thanks for the info on it - much appreciated
#25: Re: Totally dead - but random! Author: V9977, Location: Athens, GreecePosted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 4:24 pm ----
mbc007 wrote:
Great, thanks.
Those earth straps seemed fine when i looked today.
I'll check that cabin loom. Thanks for the info on it - much appreciated
Check the straps from the battery (both +ve and -ve) really well.
The negative should be quite stiff with no loose 'kinks' (possible internal rot) and the positive tightly bolted to the fuse-box etc.
Might also be worth pulling and re-fitting the big fuses in the engine fuse-box incase of bad conntact in one of those (Battery must be disconnected during this!).
#26: Re: Totally dead - but random! Author: mbc007, Posted: Thu Sep 27, 2012 5:13 pm ---- ok thanks.
I did check all those big fuses today - all looked fine.
I can't say i checked the straps really well but did check the connections at each end and they seemed fine.
As i say, the car has run fine today so i'll see how things go but might just go back and check those straps again over the weekend.
thanks mate
M
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