#1: Inlet Air Temp and Coolant Temp Author: Berth, Location: DenmarkPosted: Sat Nov 22, 2014 2:01 pm ---- Hi
My 2000 GTI138 failed its MOT with a CO in idle on 1,1% and 1,2% High Idle(2500rpm)
I put my PP2000 on today to see if anything was obvious
My Downstream oxygen sensor is constant at 0mV
But i think that it might be caused the to other odd reads from PP2000
air temperature is ~59C
Coolant temperature is 46C
Both stays at the same level +/- 1
I had the car running idle for 10 min with the bonnet open and outside temp was around 5C
The tempgauge was between 70-90C
Are the sensors dead?
Is air temperature the Temp sensor in the throttlebody?
#2: Re: Inlet Air Temp and Coolant Temp Author: heyziq, Location: MalaysiaPosted: Sat Nov 22, 2014 2:13 pm ---- if urs are 2000 model then u only have 1 o2 sensor, or u have older type ecu which have 1 sensor... i have this type too
#3: Re: Inlet Air Temp and Coolant Temp Author: Berth, Location: DenmarkPosted: Sun Nov 23, 2014 2:31 am ---- I have Two O2 sensors, one before the cat and one after, the car is from 10/2000 with RFN engine
#4: Re: Inlet Air Temp and Coolant Temp Author: macj, Location: EssexPosted: Sun Nov 23, 2014 5:29 am ---- If you were sitting at idle for that long there is a good possibility that air temp is getting high from the engine bay heat.... coolant temp sensor is probably no good as it should be nearly double that. I would try that one first
#5: Re: Inlet Air Temp and Coolant Temp Author: Edward, Location: In the garagePosted: Sun Nov 23, 2014 8:32 am ----
heyziq wrote:
if urs are 2000 model then u only have 1 o2 sensor, or u have older type ecu which have 1 sensor... i have this type too
Not as simple as that. RFN coded cars are from 2000 onwards and have two sensors. Earlier RFR cars just has one.
#6: Re: Inlet Air Temp and Coolant Temp Author: Addaz, Location: SuffolkPosted: Sun Nov 23, 2014 10:46 am ---- Was your lambda open or closed loop when you registered 0mv?
Intake sensor sounds dodgy, what does it register with the car no running? Do you have a gay intake on it though?
#7: Re: Inlet Air Temp and Coolant Temp Author: kandlbarrett, Location: SwindonPosted: Mon Nov 24, 2014 6:45 am ---- If you can do a live drive test. lambda sensors should be voltage switching rapidyly.
#8: Re: Inlet Air Temp and Coolant Temp Author: Berth, Location: DenmarkPosted: Mon Nov 24, 2014 1:37 pm ----
Addaz wrote:
Was your lambda open or closed loop when you registered 0mv?
Intake sensor sounds dodgy, what does it register with the car no running? Do you have a gay intake on it though?
I Think it was in open loop hence it didnt registeret anything, where would it show open/closed loop?
What determine if open or closed?
I have tested both o2 censors with a voltmeter, While car running in idle both registers between 0,1 and 0,8 volt
I have a new intake temp sensor on the way, and a new cooling temp sensor
Intake is standard with kn panel
#9: Re: Inlet Air Temp and Coolant Temp Author: Berth, Location: DenmarkPosted: Mon Nov 24, 2014 1:39 pm ----
kandlbarrett wrote:
If you can do a live drive test. lambda sensors should be voltage switching rapidyly.
Live drive test has to wait a few days as i am fixing my front brakes as well
Could it be that exhaust isnt hot enought when just running idle?
#10: Re: Inlet Air Temp and Coolant Temp Author: Berth, Location: DenmarkPosted: Mon Nov 24, 2014 2:30 pm ---- I got this screendump from yesterday with the o2 sensors reading
downstream sensor states 0mV but in the infobox in the bottom it states that in open loop it should be between 0,1v and 1,0v
#11: Re: Inlet Air Temp and Coolant Temp Author: Berth, Location: DenmarkPosted: Tue Dec 09, 2014 10:22 am ---- Still have an issue with to High CO
I have a Maniflow 4-2-1 exhaust with a 200cell cat
The first o2 sensor is placed in the manifold where Two pipes join, is this right or do i need to move it to a location where gas from all 4 cylinders Will reach?
#12: Re: Inlet Air Temp and Coolant Temp Author: kandlbarrett, Location: SwindonPosted: Tue Dec 09, 2014 12:01 pm ---- Whilst less than perfect this shouldn't cause a problem. Though it does mean that lambda is only reading two cylinders and the second is reading all 4.
In cars with the pre cat lambda reading two cylinders there is usually a pair of pre cat lambdas each reading two cylinders but, as already said, if the car is running correctly this shouldn't be a problem though it will make diagnosis a little harder.
With your readings (voltmeter suggests lambda is OK but PP say different) I would start to suspect broken wire or poor connection.
Does it give an output on PP at any throttle position? If not but your meter is showing it giving an output then it is almost certainly broken wire or bad connection.
#13: Re: Inlet Air Temp and Coolant Temp Author: 206gt160, Location: BlackburnPosted: Tue Dec 09, 2014 12:05 pm ---- That manifold is beautiful
#14: Re: Inlet Air Temp and Coolant Temp Author: Berth, Location: DenmarkPosted: Tue Dec 09, 2014 12:39 pm ----
kandlbarrett wrote:
Whilst less than perfect this shouldn't cause a problem. Though it does mean that lambda is only reading two cylinders and the second is reading all 4.
In cars with the pre cat lambda reading two cylinders there is usually a pair of pre cat lambdas each reading two cylinders but, as already said, if the car is running correctly this shouldn't be a problem though it will make diagnosis a little harder.
With your readings (voltmeter suggests lambda is OK but PP say different) I would start to suspect broken wire or poor connection.
Does it give an output on PP at any throttle position? If not but your meter is showing it giving an output then it is almost certainly broken wire or bad connection.
When running the car with PP the upstream Sensor switches between 50mV and 900mV but not as rapidly as i would expect
The Downstream sensor stays at 0mV - this sensor is 4 month old but is a noname product.
I Will try to switch the Two sensors just to see if i Can get a Reading from the Downstream
#15: Re: Inlet Air Temp and Coolant Temp Author: Berth, Location: DenmarkPosted: Tue Dec 09, 2014 12:40 pm ----
206gt160 wrote:
That manifold is beautiful
And the car runs great, besidde this issue, and Sound good and loud
#16: Re: Inlet Air Temp and Coolant Temp Author: Edward, Location: In the garagePosted: Tue Dec 09, 2014 2:35 pm ---- I hope you've got uprated engine mounts with that manifold.
#17: Re: Inlet Air Temp and Coolant Temp Author: Berth, Location: DenmarkPosted: Tue Dec 09, 2014 3:07 pm ---- Back from the cold
I connected the downstream sensor (after the cat) with the upstream plug and got a Reading in PP, that looks more correct than with the original upstream sensor, it changes more frequent and the top is 900mV.
So i need a new upstream sensor.
The plug from the upstream sensor didnt fit in the downstream plug
And i must have a broken wire somewhere between the connection and the ecu
What is the downstream used for it dosnt seem to make any readings but engine light dosnt go on and there are no errors?
#18: Re: Inlet Air Temp and Coolant Temp Author: Berth, Location: DenmarkPosted: Tue Dec 09, 2014 4:29 pm ----
Edward wrote:
I hope you've got uprated engine mounts with that manifold.
I did, actually i think that it was a post from you in the past that made me decide for the maniflow exhaust
Do you have issues with High CO?
#19: Re: Inlet Air Temp and Coolant Temp Author: kandlbarrett, Location: SwindonPosted: Thu Dec 11, 2014 11:16 am ---- Down stream is to check your CAT is doing its job. Don't be too quick to take the results to show upstream sensor is needed. The two lambdas will be slightly different so swapping them may cause the lambda, when used in a different exhaust position, to behave slightly differently.
Also some CATs (not all) need burst of the engine running lean to ensure the CAT works correctly and that is also part of the monitoring.
#20: Re: Inlet Air Temp and Coolant Temp Author: Edward, Location: In the garagePosted: Thu Dec 11, 2014 11:58 am ---- Are you checking the lambda sensor when the engine is cold? I don't think the sensor is used until maybe 70 degrees.
#21: Re: Inlet Air Temp and Coolant Temp Author: Berth, Location: DenmarkPosted: Thu Dec 11, 2014 1:31 pm ----
Edward wrote:
Are you checking the lambda sensor when the engine is cold? I don't think the sensor is used until maybe 70 degrees.
Only the last test to see if it could register anything with the other sensor
With pp2000 ready on a cold car, the upstream sensor Will show a constant around 900mV for 30-60sec i guess that during this process the sensor is heatet up? After this it Will start to shift between High and low.
I am not sure that pp2000 is the best method for testing the lamba, it seems a little sluggish when updating the screen, an oscilloscope would be better?
#22: Re: Inlet Air Temp and Coolant Temp Author: Berth, Location: DenmarkPosted: Thu Dec 11, 2014 1:36 pm ----
kandlbarrett wrote:
Down stream is to check your CAT is doing its job. Don't be too quick to take the results to show upstream sensor is needed. The two lambdas will be slightly different so swapping them may cause the lambda, when used in a different exhaust position, to behave slightly differently.
Also some CATs (not all) need burst of the engine running lean to ensure the CAT works correctly and that is also part of the monitoring.
Great so i need to have pp2000 with me in the car to verify.
I changed the upstream sensor today, and moved it so now it Will get gas from all 4 cylinders.
The CO tester at the local do it your self garage was broken so haven't testet yet
#23: Re: Inlet Air Temp and Coolant Temp Author: Steve206, Location: UKPosted: Thu Dec 11, 2014 2:03 pm ---- Engine idle speed looks a little low?
#24: Re: Inlet Air Temp and Coolant Temp Author: Berth, Location: DenmarkPosted: Tue Dec 16, 2014 10:31 am ---- Got a new laptop with pp2000 and took the car for a run
Outside temp 5C
Car was cold when starting, coolant temp in PP started at 56C after a 10-15 min run PP where at 42C?
Then Dashboard temp gauge Said 90C and the fan started....
If the ecu never get a coolant temp of 80C an above Will it then keeper running Rich?
#25: Re: Inlet Air Temp and Coolant Temp Author: kandlbarrett, Location: SwindonPosted: Tue Dec 16, 2014 10:53 am ---- You probably have two sensors. One for ECU and fueling. The second for gauge temp. Haynes manual is very good on this point of what sensors do what.
Time to try a swap of the sensor that sends its signal to the ECU.
Depending on how long you have been running rich, if that is the problem, your CAT my now be knackered - they don't like excess fuel and it will destroy them.
I do still have a niggling doubt about running rich as the first sensor is still switching though slowly.
#26: Re: Inlet Air Temp and Coolant Temp Author: Berth, Location: DenmarkPosted: Wed Dec 17, 2014 10:02 am ----
kandlbarrett wrote:
You probably have two sensors. One for ECU and fueling. The second for gauge temp. Haynes manual is very good on this point of what sensors do what.
Time to try a swap of the sensor that sends its signal to the ECU.
Depending on how long you have been running rich, if that is the problem, your CAT my now be knackered - they don't like excess fuel and it will destroy them.
I do still have a niggling doubt about running rich as the first sensor is still switching though slowly.
I have tried changing the coolant temp sensor, the resultat is the same,
how reliable is the Pp2000 "china" model, would it make sense to try another obd box?
#27: Re: Inlet Air Temp and Coolant Temp Author: Berth, Location: DenmarkPosted: Wed Dec 17, 2014 2:39 pm ---- I am not the only one with this issue
We are not responsible for comments posted by our users, as they are the property of the poster
Interactive software released under GNU GPL,
Code Credits,
Privacy Policy
Membership:
Latest: 
New Today: 0
New Yesterday: 0
Overall: 17129
Online Now [252]:
Visitors: 251
Members: 0
Staff Online Now:
Page Views:
General
