#1: glow plugs constantly powered Author: jaaquo, Posted: Tue Feb 09, 2016 5:10 pm ---- Hi guys, so i bought a 2002 206 1.4 HDi back in August 2015.
last week i decided to open the dash binnacle to see why the dipped beam light was very dimmed.
so out comes the binnacle i open it up and in there staring at me are rolled up pieces of tissue paper, stuffed into the Engine Management Light and the Airbag warning light hole.
I suppose i should of been worried when a Haynes Manual came with the car!
so went to my mates garage and got it plugged in and these are the fault codes that were shown:
"P0382 - Preheating relay circuit fault. Plugs permanently supplied"
"P1801 - Drivers Level 1 Airbag Igniter Open Circuit"
"P1601 - Drivers Level 1 Airbag Igniter Short Circuit To Earth"
so the fault is permanent and the car is in limp mode.
the car starts and drives fine up to 3000rpm
Engine Management Light is illuminated constantly
Airbag light is illuminated constantly
glow plug indicator light doesn't light up when ignition turned on.
so to try and fix this i have done the following.
for the Glow plug fault.
first changed the glow plug relay, this worked for all of 15-30 minutes the car revved above 3000rpm and the glow plug indicator light came on with the ignition and then it entered limp mode again and the glow plug indicator didnt show. I'm going to my mates again tomorrow to see if the codes have changed, or if it is just the EML not being cleared which is keeping the car in limp mode.
I opened up the old relay to see what it was like inside, and it all looked very clean, with no damage, the spring, coil, pcb, everything looked like it should, so maybe this wasn't the faulty item.
then went on to checking the voltages;
pin 1 = ground = 0.01 ohms
pin 2 = unused
pin 3 = ignition switch = 0v ignition off & 12.3v (battery voltage) when ignition on
pin 4 = signal FROM ECU = 10.4v when plug is unplugged from relay
pin 5 = signal TO ECU = 3.4v when plug is unplugged from relay
(however when both pin 4 and pin 5 are plugged in to the relay, they both = 9.4v
m6 thread = constant power from battery = 12v
m5 thread = switched power to the glow plugs = 12v after ignition switched on
this voltage at the m5 thread is always there (when ignition is on), and doesn't turn off. i set a stop watch for 5 minutes and watched it to make sure!
i have a feeling that the fault is in the ECU, due to the control signals being constant, but then if the voltages are the same when the ignition is on wouldn't this cancel each other? i think that is how the ECU controls the glow plugs, voltage in is greater than voltage out so plugs heat up, when finished heating the voltages equal one another cancelling each other out. i just expected to see the control voltage switch off after the time delay, as they are the switching voltages for the relay.
i have thought about putting a manual switch inline on the ignition line, as this should trick the ECU into thinking the relay is off.
i started trying to figure out where the glow plugs are, but it started to rain quite heavily and i was out with no cover so called it a day.
the haynes manual says the plugs are under the cylinder head cover, is this correct? anyone know of a clear "how-to" for removing/testing/finding the glow plugs?
any how onto the airbag faults,
the previous owner said he did something like adjust the indicator stalks or something, I'm not too sure, but they are very sloppy and have a lot of play in them, so i have found a steering wheel (mine is like powder the leather cover has failed that badly) the drivers airbag, the indicator stalks and the com2000 for £50 and will just replace all these components, as i don't trust what he has done or messed with. and fingers crossed this will sort the issue out with the airbag.
so if anyone can give me solutions to this i would be most grateful!
thanks all
Jack
#2: Re: glow plugs constantly powered Author: Steve206, Location: UKPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2016 2:06 pm ---- Are the glow plugs supposed to be constantly supplied? I thought that they were? Don't bother with a second hand com2000. They can be bought relatively cheap from EuroCarParts new.
#3: Re: glow plugs constantly powered Author: jaaquo, Posted: Wed Feb 10, 2016 2:16 pm ---- so with some more investigation today i have come to the assumption of the following:
when the relay is made the voltage from the m5 thread then goes through to terminal 5, up to the ECU and on to the dash light.
and the switching action is created by the ECU making a ground on terminal 4 allowing terminal 3 (ignition 12v) to flow through the coil and switch the relay. in its relaxed state, the voltage from terminal 3 goes through terminal 1 straight to ground.
i mocked up a circuit off the car and got the relay to switch when the following happened:
terminal 1 = ground 12v when relay open
terminal 2 = unused
terminal 3 = 12v constant
terminal 4 = ground 12v when relay closed
terminal 5 = 12v when relay closed
so my thought is that the ground point for where the ECU sends the grounding signal from terminal 4 is bad, creating a high resistance and stopping the relay switching.
#4: Re: glow plugs constantly powered Author: jaaquo, Posted: Wed Feb 10, 2016 2:21 pm ---- the glow plugs are supposed to be supplied with voltage for an initial pre heat period when ignition is switched on, then a post heat period for 60 seconds after the engine is started. after this there should be no voltage at the glow plugs, otherwise they will burn out.
#5: Re: glow plugs constantly powered Author: gazza82, Location: South BucksPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2016 3:37 pm ---- What did you test it with? If it wasn't PP2000 I wouldn't believe any code returned.
Your car is same as mine and unless it is a Peugeot/Citroen specific diagnostic system it doesn't always interpret the codes properly. A 2002 diesel is pre EOBD standard.
#6: Re: glow plugs constantly powered Author: jaaquo, Posted: Wed Feb 10, 2016 5:16 pm ---- was tested with a snap on tester at a garage. the codes seem pretty spot on, as the glow plugs are currently being constantly powered, when they shouldnt be, and the airbag light is illuminated on the dash. and those were the only codes showing.
#7: Re: glow plugs constantly powered Author: jaaquo, Posted: Thu May 26, 2016 12:09 pm ---- gazza82 i see you have osted before about your glow plugs problem, any idea what the fix was? im going to clean the ground on the front r/h headlight and check the wires for breaks fingers crossed i find something!
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