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Forums › Tuning, Modification & Legal › Project Cars › Macs rally 206 project..latest rolling road results 200+hp |
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 Posted: Fri Aug 05, 2011 5:47 am |
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Joined: Feb 07, 2010
Posts: 3085
Trade Rating: +12
Location: Essex
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Its comparable.... bear in mind I have less weight, better brakes and a slight advantage in experience. But after FCS for example then ... yes it is quicker. The 180 has always been a problem because of the VVT. But its not impossible.
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Posted: Fri Aug 05, 2011 5:56 am |
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Joined: Feb 08, 2010
Posts: 7045
Trade Rating: +5
Location: In the garage
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Are those 70mm trumpets? Will that air filter back plate fit alongside a standard PAS pump? I want one of them for mine. It might fit but I'm not 100% sure. Would youi be able to do me a favour and measure the distance from side of TB to the edge of the back plate?
Will the bigger valves not mean the torque peak is moved higher up the rev range?
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| 2001 GTi 138, Bilstein Sprint dampers, H&R springs, 21mm Peugeot Sport torsion bars, 22mm rear ARB, Peugeot Sport Group A wishbones, 283mm discs, Goodridge stainless hoses, Maniflow 304 grade 4-2-1 2.5" manifold and system, 200 cell cat, Richard Longman head, 45mm Jenvey throttle bodies, 9.5mm TB spacers, 90mm air horns, Jenvey throttle linkage, Jenvey fuel rail, Aeromotive and Goodridge fuel fittings and braided hose, ITG sausage filter, Radtec custom radiator, Piper Ultimate Road cams, Piper vernier pulleys, Omex 600 ECU. Saxo electric PAS pump, Vibra Technics engine mounts. Samco coolant hoses, TTV steel flywheel, 4.76 final drive ratio, 307 CC 180 ratios. 2019 BMW 530i. 2017 Mercedes C300 convertible. | |
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Posted: Fri Aug 05, 2011 5:57 am |
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Joined: Feb 08, 2010
Posts: 10151
Trade Rating: +12
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no plan to get some HC piston too? or it is a waste of money?
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Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2011 11:08 am |
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Joined: Feb 07, 2010
Posts: 3085
Trade Rating: +12
Location: Essex
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Ok, Update on progress so far. The old engine is stripped and was ready for a rebuild apparently, Charlie says I have thrashed the granny out of it and it shows in the bearing metal 
The next issue was the forged rods. The box says "206 2.0 litre" but the measurements say they are 1600 rods. I will need to confirm this as the only difference in the measurements are the small end bearing, 18mm on these rods and the 2.0 litre has 21mm. The other issue was removing the wrist pin from the pistons...... they are pressed and Charlie was sure the pistons would be damaged.
I have made a few phone calls and now have a set of Wossner forged rods and pistons on the way, however they are the higher compression ratio which is not really what I wanted. The idea was to get more torgue in the lower rev range and the higher CR may be a problem here.
The head is in the process of being worked so we should start to see more progress soon.... Refit, run in for 10 minutes and then off for a re-map and another power graph for you lot 
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Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2011 11:10 am |
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Joined: Feb 26, 2011
Posts: 2977
Trade Rating: +34
Location: Nuneaton
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Sounds good mate, what bhp you hoping for?
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Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2011 11:58 am |
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Joined: Feb 07, 2010
Posts: 3085
Trade Rating: +12
Location: Essex
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I have 183 HP at present with 167 ft/lb of torgue, The ideal scenario for me would be 180 odd HP at 6500rpm with 120 ft/lb of torgue at 1500rpm 
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Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2011 12:33 pm |
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Joined: Feb 08, 2010
Posts: 7045
Trade Rating: +5
Location: In the garage
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I thought all pistons were scrap once the gudgeon pin had been removed.
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| 2001 GTi 138, Bilstein Sprint dampers, H&R springs, 21mm Peugeot Sport torsion bars, 22mm rear ARB, Peugeot Sport Group A wishbones, 283mm discs, Goodridge stainless hoses, Maniflow 304 grade 4-2-1 2.5" manifold and system, 200 cell cat, Richard Longman head, 45mm Jenvey throttle bodies, 9.5mm TB spacers, 90mm air horns, Jenvey throttle linkage, Jenvey fuel rail, Aeromotive and Goodridge fuel fittings and braided hose, ITG sausage filter, Radtec custom radiator, Piper Ultimate Road cams, Piper vernier pulleys, Omex 600 ECU. Saxo electric PAS pump, Vibra Technics engine mounts. Samco coolant hoses, TTV steel flywheel, 4.76 final drive ratio, 307 CC 180 ratios. 2019 BMW 530i. 2017 Mercedes C300 convertible. | |
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Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2011 1:08 pm |
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Joined: Feb 07, 2010
Posts: 3085
Trade Rating: +12
Location: Essex
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| Edward wrote: |
| I thought all pistons were scrap once the gudgeon pin had been removed. |
Only non-floaters aparently.... I will settle for the Wossners and see if its possible to lower the CR with a bit of machining
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Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2011 1:29 pm |
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Joined: Feb 08, 2010
Posts: 10151
Trade Rating: +12
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why would HC piston reduce low end torque?
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Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2011 1:30 pm |
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Joined: Feb 08, 2010
Posts: 10151
Trade Rating: +12
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| macj wrote: |
| Edward wrote: |
| I thought all pistons were scrap once the gudgeon pin had been removed. |
Only non-floaters aparently.... I will settle for the Wossners and see if its possible to lower the CR with a bit of machining |
decompression plate?
buget turbo tuner first choices 
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Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2011 1:49 pm |
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Joined: Feb 07, 2010
Posts: 3085
Trade Rating: +12
Location: Essex
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| Seabook wrote: |
| macj wrote: |
| Edward wrote: |
| I thought all pistons were scrap once the gudgeon pin had been removed. |
Only non-floaters aparently.... I will settle for the Wossners and see if its possible to lower the CR with a bit of machining |
decompression plate?
buget turbo tuner first choices |
High fuel loads on full throttle openings at low rpm = knock with higher CR
As there is no knock sensor and the fuelling map has to be perfect it is not as easy to get good torque figures low down
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Last edited by macj on Mon Aug 15, 2011 3:14 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2011 2:09 pm |
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Joined: Feb 08, 2010
Posts: 7045
Trade Rating: +5
Location: In the garage
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What would it take to fit the original knock sensor? Can the ECU detect knock?
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| 2001 GTi 138, Bilstein Sprint dampers, H&R springs, 21mm Peugeot Sport torsion bars, 22mm rear ARB, Peugeot Sport Group A wishbones, 283mm discs, Goodridge stainless hoses, Maniflow 304 grade 4-2-1 2.5" manifold and system, 200 cell cat, Richard Longman head, 45mm Jenvey throttle bodies, 9.5mm TB spacers, 90mm air horns, Jenvey throttle linkage, Jenvey fuel rail, Aeromotive and Goodridge fuel fittings and braided hose, ITG sausage filter, Radtec custom radiator, Piper Ultimate Road cams, Piper vernier pulleys, Omex 600 ECU. Saxo electric PAS pump, Vibra Technics engine mounts. Samco coolant hoses, TTV steel flywheel, 4.76 final drive ratio, 307 CC 180 ratios. 2019 BMW 530i. 2017 Mercedes C300 convertible. | |
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Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2011 2:45 pm |
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Joined: Feb 07, 2010
Posts: 3085
Trade Rating: +12
Location: Essex
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| Edward wrote: |
| What would it take to fit the original knock sensor? Can the ECU detect knock? |
Yes it can be run with a knock sensor but it is better to run without in this application, The knock is detected during mapping with a stethescope
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Posted: Mon Aug 15, 2011 3:12 pm |
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Joined: Feb 08, 2010
Posts: 10151
Trade Rating: +12
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| macj wrote: |
| Seabook wrote: |
| macj wrote: |
| Edward wrote: |
| I thought all pistons were scrap once the gudgeon pin had been removed. |
Only non-floaters aparently.... I will settle for the Wossners and see if its possible to lower the CR with a bit of machining |
decompression plate?
buget turbo tuner first choices |
High fuel loads on full throttle openings at low rpm = knock with higher CR
As there is no knock sensor and the fulling map has to be perfect it is not as easy to get good torque figures low down |
always learn something new everyday
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Posted: Tue Aug 16, 2011 3:44 pm |
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Joined: Feb 07, 2010
Posts: 3085
Trade Rating: +12
Location: Essex
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I think we should all have an educated guess on what you all think the final power/torque figures will be after these modifications
1. big valve head ported and chamber matched, welded up EGR port.
2. re-tapered inlet manifold to better match the 45mm T/B`s
3. mild knife edged crank with full bottom end balance
4. forged rods and H/C forged pistons (12.5:1) with ARP bolts
5. competition head gasket
What are your thoughts 
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